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#11
11-11-2007, 08:39 PM
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Re: soap c/r
The question should be fold or call, not call or 3bet. How much of his range is KJ and QT? You have outs vs. QT. I can certainly fold this turn, but probably end up calling down. The idea that you want to 3bet here to "protect your hand from SB's gutshot" is laughable.
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#12
11-11-2007, 09:05 PM
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Re: soap c/r
[ QUOTE ]
a few qualifiers, i am quite laggy compared to most live players also, i think soap caps JJ and KK every time in this spot... i think QTs, KJs and a very discounted JJ make up his range... my rationale behind 3-betting the turn was that the sb almost always has 4 outs to his gut shot and in this large of a pot i want to do everything i can to protect my hand (if i am ahead)... i hope that helps give the conversation some direction [/ QUOTE ] soap has you beat here the vast majority of the time. the only way he doesn't is if you are indeed a complete lagtardspewmonkey and he knows it, and thus he feels you could be dumb enough to have AK or AA here.
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#13
11-11-2007, 09:45 PM
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Re: soap c/r
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] a few qualifiers, i am quite laggy compared to most live players also, i think soap caps JJ and KK every time in this spot... i think QTs, KJs and a very discounted JJ make up his range... my rationale behind 3-betting the turn was that the sb almost always has 4 outs to his gut shot and in this large of a pot i want to do everything i can to protect my hand (if i am ahead)... i hope that helps give the conversation some direction [/ QUOTE ] soap has you beat here the vast majority of the time. the only way he doesn't is if you are indeed a complete lagtardspewmonkey and he knows it, and thus he feels you could be dumb enough to have AK or AA here. [/ QUOTE ] I actually considered this to be a possibility, but I think what is much more probable is that Soap is reacting to the sb. Crappy drunk businessmen are the kind of players that go ape on the flop w/ Ak ui or something else retarded postflop. They are not generally the types to cold 4-bet w/ trash out of the sb.
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#15
11-12-2007, 01:22 AM
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Re: soap c/r
soap raises QTs utg?
i think his range is more JJ then QTs
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#16
11-12-2007, 02:05 AM
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Re: soap c/r
[ QUOTE ]
a few qualifiers, i am quite laggy compared to most live players also, i think soap caps JJ and KK every time in this spot... i think QTs, KJs and a very discounted JJ make up his range... my rationale behind 3-betting the turn was that the sb almost always has 4 outs to his gut shot and in this large of a pot i want to do everything i can to protect my hand (if i am ahead)... i hope that helps give the conversation some direction [/ QUOTE ] Dude-- That's not "direction." That's reducing the thread to arithmetic any experienced player should be able to do in about ten seconds. If all I know is that soap is a good player, then I definitely don't cap preflop. By the time we get to the ellipsis in the OP you should be in crying-call mode despite the overlay from the SB. Three-betting is bonkers unless there's bizarre image stuff you didn't tell us about. --Nate
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#18
11-12-2007, 03:36 AM
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Re: soap c/r
seems way off five
how is this not JJ... you discount that because you think he would cap it pflop... you raise utg, get three bet next in, cold 4 bet in the sb drunk or not... are you capping or calling with JJ from the action thus far i still think his range is weighted heavily toward JJ, and putting in more bets at any point in the hand seems foolish unless a nine or jack peels off.
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#19
11-12-2007, 03:38 AM
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Re: soap c/r
[ QUOTE ]
seems way off five how is this not JJ... you discount that because you think he would cap it pflop... you raise utg, get three bet next in, cold 4 bet in the sb drunk or not... are you capping or calling with JJ from the action thus far i still think his range is weighted heavily toward JJ, and putting in more bets at any point in the hand seems foolish unless a nine or jack peels off. [/ QUOTE ] a jack changes nothing.
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#20
11-12-2007, 03:47 AM
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Re: soap c/r
a jack would make it much less likely he has JJ and it would then change the weighting of his hand ranges
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