downswing, looking for help.... - Page 3

hunt1897 · #21 07-26-2007, 03:17 PM

If you enjoy playing, play. If you want to get serious, stay away from it for a while.

CmnDwnWrkn · #22 07-26-2007, 03:18 PM

It looks to me like you are over-valuing pocket pairs and hands where you have one-pair. This is a common mistake, and it tends to get a lot of players in trouble. Especially if you play a TAG style - you are playing so few hands you want to win when you finally do play a hand.

It's important to learn that a lot of your winnings in this game come from the better made hands - two pair, three of a kind, straights, flushes, full houses, etc. One pair, including pocket pairs that don't hit a set, are relatively weak hands and they often are beat after the flop or subsequent betting rounds.

If you encounter substantial resistance when you have an unimproved pocket pair or one pair, is is important that you be able to let these go.

There are times when one pair and pocket pairs are good, especially when the flop misses your opponent. But oftentimes these hands aren't your big moneymakers (except when you hit a set with your pocket pair, then this can be very lucrative)

So in general, try to keep the pots smaller when you have a weakish hand. Save the bigger pots for better hands like sets and straights. And learn to get away from hands when you sense you are beat

sluggger5x · #23 07-26-2007, 03:35 PM

here are some postion stats (not very pretty):

Triggerle · #24 07-26-2007, 04:13 PM

Seeing you position stats I think it is very likely that in addition to making mistakes you are also not running really well over this stretch. Your combination of WTSD and W$SD with otherwise fine positional stats looks really ugly.

This opinion of mine shouldn't be any excuse for you to not analyse your play session by session but it might help your confidence if you don't find enough mistakes to justify being down so much.

CmnDwnWrkn · #25 07-26-2007, 04:22 PM

I think no amount of hand/poker tracker analysis is going to help. If you are subject to playing while under "severe tilt", that is more than enough to shift you from being a winning or break-even player to being a losing player.

Get the tilt under control. Don't play while tilting. I guarantee that is your #1 leak right now.

sluggger5x · #26 07-26-2007, 04:31 PM

Well while tilt is an issue, I would say that there is no more than 5 or 6 hands that I would attribute directly to tilt. They are the obvious hands like the AQ or JJ preflop pushes I made in the hh's back there. The problem really is that I tend to overvalue sooo many hands after a devastating run and leaks just seem to develop.

So maybe these actions and reactions are essentially because of my tilt, but either way I know that leaks exist.

Lately the mindset has been asking how bad each hand is going to go. When you get top 2 pair/sets coolered several times in a session, you suddenly feel that every decent hand you hit is beaten. I just feel completely defeated psychologically and as a result I am making some obvious misplays.

JoseyWales · #27 07-26-2007, 04:33 PM

[ QUOTE ]
Typically I play 6-8 tables. I really struggle with game selection and finding people who I can beat easily while multitabling.

[/ QUOTE ]

Try onetabling for a while. I really don't understand why more tables is always "better". Maybe if you played less tables you'd notice your mistakes better.

sluggger5x · #28 07-26-2007, 04:46 PM

Ok here is batch #2 from the deadly run. I realize that a few of these might be "read dependent", but the goal is to try and spot general leaks. If you want PT numbers on any of these hands I can give them if you want what reads i have...

******* Hand 1 ********

Full Tilt Poker
No Limit Holdem Ring game
Blinds: $0.25/$0.50
5 players
Converter

Stack sizes:
UTG: $55.75
CO: $95
Button: $48.25
sluggger5x: $48.25
BB: $74.10

Pre-flop: (5 players) sluggger5x is SB with 4[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 4[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]
2 folds, Button raises to $1.5, sluggger5x calls, BB calls.

Flop: T[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] J[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 4[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] ($4.5, 3 players)
sluggger5x bets $4, BB calls, Button folds.

Turn: Q[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] ($12.5, 2 players)
sluggger5x checks, BB bets $12.5, sluggger5x calls.

River: 7[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] ($37.5, 2 players)
sluggger5x is all-in $30.25, BB calls.

Results:
Final pot: $98

******* Hand 2 ********

Full Tilt Poker
No Limit Holdem Ring game
Blinds: $0.25/$0.50
4 players
Converter

Stack sizes:
UTG: $86.65
sluggger5x: $66
SB: $83.85
SB: $48.25
BB: $48.25

Pre-flop: (4 players) sluggger5x is Button with J[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] K[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]
UTG raises to $1.75, sluggger5x calls, SB folds, BB calls.

Flop: T[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 9[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] J[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] ($5.5, 3 players)
BB checks, UTG bets $5.5, sluggger5x calls, BB folds.

Turn: K[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] ($16.5, 2 players)
UTG bets $16.5, sluggger5x calls.

River: T[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] ($49.5, 2 players)
UTG bets $49.5, sluggger5x calls all-in $42.25.
Uncalled bets: $7.25 returned to UTG.

Results:
Final pot: $134

******* Hand 3 ********

Full Tilt Poker
No Limit Holdem Ring game
Blinds: $0.25/$0.50
6 players
Converter

Stack sizes:
UTG: $50.25
UTG+1: $57.70
sluggger5x: $57.55
Button: $46.70
SB: $49.25
BB: $16.50

Pre-flop: (6 players) sluggger5x is CO with A[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] J[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]
UTG folds, UTG+1 calls, sluggger5x raises to $2.5, 3 folds, UTG+1 calls.

Flop: A[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] K[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] Q[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] ($5.75, 2 players)
UTG+1 bets $0.5, sluggger5x raises to $4, UTG+1 calls.

Turn: 4[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] ($13.75, 2 players)
UTG+1 checks, sluggger5x bets $9.5, UTG+1 calls.

River: 5[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] ($32.75, 2 players)
UTG+1 bets $10, sluggger5x calls.

Results:
Final pot: $52.75

******* Hand 4 ********

Full Tilt Poker
No Limit Holdem Ring game
Blinds: $0.25/$0.50
6 players
Converter

Stack sizes:
UTG: $54.90
UTG+1: $30.10
CO: $50
sluggger5x: $51.65
SB: $73.50
BB: $202.50

Pre-flop: (6 players) sluggger5x is Button with J[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] J[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]
UTG folds, UTG+1 calls, CO calls, sluggger5x raises to $3, 3 folds, CO calls.

Flop: K[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 4[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] Q[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] ($7.25, 2 players)
CO checks, sluggger5x bets $4.5, CO calls.

Turn: 9[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] ($16.25, 2 players)
CO checks, sluggger5x bets $10, CO calls.

River: T[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] ($36.25, 2 players)
CO is all-in $32.5, sluggger5x calls.

Results:
Final pot: $101.25

******* Hand 5 ********

Full Tilt Poker
No Limit Holdem Ring game
Blinds: $0.25/$0.50
6 players
Converter

Stack sizes:
UTG: $66.95
UTG+1: $49.70
CO: $45.25
sluggger5x: $68.30
SB: $91
BB: $50.75

Pre-flop: (6 players) sluggger5x is Button with Q[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] Q[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]
2 folds, CO raises to $1.75, sluggger5x raises to $6, 2 folds, CO calls.

Flop: 5[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 8[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 2[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] ($12.75, 2 players)
CO checks, sluggger5x bets $12.75, CO raises to $30, sluggger5x raises all-in $62.3, CO calls all-in $9.25.
Uncalled bets: $23.05 returned to sluggger5x.

Turn: 9[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] ($91.25, 0 player + 2 all-in - Main pot: $91.25)

River: 6[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] ($91.25, 0 player + 2 all-in - Main pot: $91.25)

Results:
Final pot: $91.25

******* Hand 6 ********

Full Tilt Poker
No Limit Holdem Ring game
Blinds: $0.25/$0.50
6 players
Converter

Stack sizes:
UTG: $10.30
sluggger5x: $50
CO: $48.75
Button: $39
SB: $86.55
BB: $104.25

Pre-flop: (6 players) sluggger5x is UTG+1 with K[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] A[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]
UTG raises to $1, sluggger5x raises to $3, CO folds, Button calls, 2 folds, UTG calls.

Flop: 3[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 8[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] A[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] ($9.75, 3 players)
UTG is all-in $7.3, sluggger5x calls, Button raises to $20, sluggger5x raises to $40, Button calls all-in $36, sluggger5x calls.

Turn: 2[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] ($129.05, 1 player + 2 all-in - Main pot: $31.65, Sidepot 1: $97.4)

River: A[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] ($129.05, 1 player + 2 all-in - Main pot: $31.65, Sidepot 1: $97.4)

Results:
Final pot: $129.05

******* Hand 7 ********

Full Tilt Poker
No Limit Holdem Ring game
Blinds: $0.25/$0.50
6 players
Converter

Stack sizes:
UTG: $183.80
UTG+1: $18.20
CO: $62.15
Button: $43.75
SB: $64.90
sluggger5x: $49.75

Pre-flop: (6 players) sluggger5x is BB with K[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] K[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]
3 folds, Button raises to $1.75, SB raises to $5.75, sluggger5x calls, Button folds.

Flop: 5[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] A[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 4[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] ($13.25, 2 players)
SB bets $8, sluggger5x calls.

Turn: 3[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] ($29.25, 2 players)
SB checks, sluggger5x checks.

River: 7[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] ($29.25, 2 players)
SB bets $18, sluggger5x calls.

Results:
Final pot: $65.25

******* Hand 8 ********

Full Tilt Poker
No Limit Holdem Ring game
Blinds: $0.25/$0.50
6 players
Converter

Stack sizes:
UTG: $48.50
UTG+1: $48
CO: $67.90
sluggger5x: $59.85
SB: $156.95
BB: $26.65

Pre-flop: (6 players) sluggger5x is Button with K[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] A[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]
3 folds, sluggger5x raises to $2, SB calls, BB folds.

Flop: 7[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] K[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] Q[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] ($4.5, 2 players)
SB checks, sluggger5x bets $4.5, SB calls.

Turn: T[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] ($13.5, 2 players)
SB bets $5, sluggger5x calls.

River: 8[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] ($23.5, 2 players)
SB bets $14, sluggger5x calls.

Results:
Final pot: $51.5

******* Hand 9 ********

Full Tilt Poker
No Limit Holdem Ring game
Blinds: $0.25/$0.50
6 players
Converter

Stack sizes:
UTG: $50.75
sluggger5x: $50
CO: $64.65
Button: $41.45
SB: $58.10
BB: $99.15

Pre-flop: (6 players) sluggger5x is UTG+1 with A[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] K[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]
UTG folds, sluggger5x raises to $2, CO folds, Button calls, 2 folds.

Flop: 5[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] K[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 2[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] ($4.75, 2 players)
sluggger5x bets $4, Button raises to $8, sluggger5x calls.

Turn: 5[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] ($20.75, 2 players)
sluggger5x bets $14, Button raises all-in $31.45, sluggger5x calls.

River: 4[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] ($83.65, 1 player + 1 all-in - Main pot: $83.65)

Results:
Final pot: $83.65

******* Hand 10 ********

Full Tilt Poker
No Limit Holdem Ring game
Blinds: $0.25/$0.50
5 players
Converter

Stack sizes:
UTG: $19.50
CO: $58.50
Button: $39.90
sluggger5x: $59.15
BB: $99.15
BB: $20

Pre-flop: (5 players) sluggger5x is SB with 8[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 8[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]
UTG folds, CO raises to $1.75, Button folds, sluggger5x calls, BB calls.

Flop: 6[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 5[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 2[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] ($5.25, 3 players)
sluggger5x bets $4, BB folds, CO calls.

Turn: 2[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] ($13.25, 2 players)
sluggger5x bets $8, CO raises to $16, sluggger5x folds.
Uncalled bets: $8 returned to CO.

Results:
Final pot: $29.25

******* Hand 11 ********

Full Tilt Poker
No Limit Holdem Ring game
Blinds: $0.25/$0.50
6 players
Converter

Stack sizes:
UTG: $46.30
UTG+1: $87.35
sluggger5x: $75.55
Button: $8.15
SB: $58.75
BB: $64.70

Pre-flop: (6 players) sluggger5x is CO with A[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] A[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]
2 folds, sluggger5x raises to $2, Button folds, SB calls, BB folds.

Flop: 9[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 5[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 6[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] ($4.5, 2 players)
SB checks, sluggger5x bets $3.5, SB raises to $9.5, sluggger5x raises to $25, SB raises all-in $56.75, sluggger5x folds.
Uncalled bets: $31.75 returned to SB.

Results:
Final pot: $54.5

******* Hand 12 ********

Full Tilt Poker
No Limit Holdem Ring game
Blinds: $0.25/$0.50
4 players
Converter

Stack sizes:
UTG+1: $87.35
CO: $75.55
UTG: $27.60
sluggger5x: $64.50
SB: $28.25
BB: $44.55

Pre-flop: (4 players) sluggger5x is Button with A[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] A[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]
UTG folds, sluggger5x raises to $2, SB calls, BB folds.

Flop: 9[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] T[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 9[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] ($4.5, 2 players)
SB checks, sluggger5x bets $3.5, SB calls.

Turn: 3[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] ($11.5, 2 players)
SB checks, sluggger5x bets $9, SB raises all-in $22.75, sluggger5x calls.

River: 6[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] ($57, 1 player + 1 all-in - Main pot: $57)

Results:
Final pot: $57

******* Hand 13 ********

Full Tilt Poker
No Limit Holdem Ring game
Blinds: $0.25/$0.50
5 players
Converter

Stack sizes:
UTG: $49.40
CO: $31.70
sluggger5x: $68.40
SB: $40.15
CO: $75.55
BB: $126.40

Pre-flop: (5 players) sluggger5x is Button with T[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] J[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]
2 folds, sluggger5x raises to $2, SB calls, BB calls.

Flop: J[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 4[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 3[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] ($6, 3 players)
SB bets $1.5, BB calls, sluggger5x raises to $6, SB calls, BB folds.

Turn: 3[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] ($19.5, 2 players)
SB checks, sluggger5x bets $12, SB raises all-in $32.15, sluggger5x folds.
Uncalled bets: $20.15 returned to SB.

Results:
Final pot: $43.5

******* Hand 14 ********

Poker Stars
No Limit Holdem Ring game
Blinds: $0.25/$0.50
6 players
Converter

Stack sizes:
UTG: $76.10
UTG+1: $50
sluggger5x: $50
Button: $53.55
SB: $15.85
BB: $179.85

Pre-flop: (6 players) sluggger5x is CO with K[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] A[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]
UTG calls, UTG+1 folds, sluggger5x raises to $2.5, 3 folds, UTG calls.

Flop: 5[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 2[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 6[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] ($5.75, 2 players)
UTG bets $3.5, sluggger5x calls.

Turn: A[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] ($12.75, 2 players)
UTG checks, sluggger5x bets $8.5, UTG raises all-in $70.1, sluggger5x calls all-in $35.5.
Uncalled bets: $26.1 returned to UTG.

River: 3[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] ($100.75, 0 player + 2 all-in - Main pot: $100.75)

Results:
Final pot: $100.75

******* Hand 15 ********

Poker Stars
No Limit Holdem Ring game
Blinds: $0.25/$0.50
5 players
Converter

Stack sizes:
sluggger5x: $78.65
CO: $50
Button: $19.25
Button: $53.55
SB: $184.30
BB: $86.90

Pre-flop: (5 players) sluggger5x is UTG with K[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] A[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]
sluggger5x raises to $2.5, 2 folds, SB raises to $7.5, BB folds, sluggger5x calls.

Flop: K[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 8[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 9[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] ($15.5, 2 players)
SB bets $4.5, sluggger5x raises to $12.5, SB raises to $97, sluggger5x calls all-in $58.65.
Uncalled bets: $25.85 returned to SB.

Turn: J[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] ($157.8, 1 player + 1 all-in - Main pot: $157.8)

River: Q[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] ($157.8, 1 player + 1 all-in - Main pot: $157.8)

Results:
Final pot: $157.8

Im putting these out there for spotting leaks, hopefully this doesn't seem selfish of me. I'm sure many of us can learn from these and spot leaks; not just for my sake alone.

AroundTheHorn · #29 07-26-2007, 04:47 PM

-don't get it all in for 100bb w/ less than KK
-don't get so attached to top pair/over pair

Nato76 · #30 07-26-2007, 04:49 PM

You play on FT right? I think I played with you recently.