400 NL: Deep stack committed? Seems ridiculous but should I c/f river?

[livestream]

I dont how this hand would develope if you lead the flop ~33. but when i just look at the pot size, you could easier push the turn AI(if if if he took the same lime). But your line is fine.
A turn push is very heavy but he could talk himself into a call by putting you on FD w pair.
But also with 400 your maximise your expectation.

river ugly in this spot but its simple. I AM COMMITED. c/c is so -EV. so shoving is the only option.

[Berge20]

I guess that I still don't see the argument for not pumping the turn Ipo. Just because we're deep? Isn't that more of a reason b/c we very likely have the best hand against two-pair/set or pair+draws and we want the money to go in now?

By calling and peeling the river, we really are making it difficult to get stacks in--especially the times where he's got a pair+draw on the turn that he might well pay a lot for.

Please elaborate

Edit: Somehow missed case's post. I'm not certain I agree, but it explains the turn call argument well.

[livestream]

turn call isnt bad.

AJs: why isnt villian shoving turn with AJs? afraid of heros freeroll? ;-)

who lead the river w/ heart and/or blank(non paired/low card)

[mattaasen]

Flop bet is fishy,makes it less likely he has Aj...... yes he mayyyy have aj of spades, but the bet makes no sense for any of the other aj hands..and that tiny bet with ajs is gross too..i also think he would shove aj on the turn if he had it the majority of the time...what is villain trying to "trap" hero for his remaining 300 after calling a 400 raise? LOL at that....obviously u lost the hand, so everyone is gonna be way results oriented....but in a vacuum not wanting to get it in on the turn is soooo weak

look guys....yes its deep.... but not even THAT deep, the guy is like 180 bb or something and is a DONK who has taken wierd lines,does DONKISH stuff, and thus far as refused to fold......just calling the turn is giving up WAY to much value because so many river cards can kill your action or potentially beat u. Second nuts, against a donk, out of position, two flush draws on the board, lots of 2/pr set type hands.............. this is the only time your gonna extract value in the hand

if we were 300bb deep or more then id consider a bit more pot control, but this is 180bb against a [censored] donk.........id be thrilled to get it in on the turn...if u are leading turn, then only calling min raise, then check calling or bet folding river....what are u waiting for? this guy stacks off with way worse here, its not the best spot, but just going into check call mode with second nuts against a donk leaves too much value on the table for me.....

Once u get to the river, u have to shove, but i wouldnt like my hand.....its just the lesser of two evils.....kind of like the turn raise here, although im much more happy about getting it in on the turn then shoving the river

[GrandMelon]

Not sure why you didnt bet the flop, just cbet like usual and start building a pot for when you hit.

Turn play is good although I might make the 3 bet a little smaller like 350 but this is ok

I curse the river card for about 30 seconds and shove since hes only got like a half pot sized bet left

[CalledDownLight]

Iponnet, I really really hat just calling the turn here. Your hand is huge and playing for 2 stacks isn't an issue imo.

I would just cbet the flop for like $28. You have 6 live outs that are basically to the nuts and 2 more that probably give you the best hand although you will want to keep the pot smallish. I think being deep is more of a reason to cbet in this spot whereas c/c seems ok with 100 BB.

I like the turn lead and would probably only make it like $333 or something to go on the 3bet, but whatever $400 is ok. Shoving is definitely suboptimal imo.

I probably think about the river for a while and then shove because I don't want to c/c here since he won't bet hardly anything we beat, but will call with some hands that had draws like KJ or TJ imo.

[too eazy]

after he minraises the turn i'm shoving like 100% of the time.

[SABR42]

[ QUOTE ]
hero smooth calls turn raise, c/c river

[/ QUOTE ]
Wait, what?

[SABR42]

Anyway, lead the flop. Even if he rarely folds, you are bloating the pot for when you hit.

Turn play is fine.

Shove river. Not shoving river is just terrible, since you are reverse-freerolling if you check.

[AllTheCheese]

Thanks for all the advice guys. Idk if this was clear from the OP, I didn't want to bet flop because I was afraid of getting raised off my draw, not called. If I c-bet to $28, and he raises to like $90, should I call?