"All in?" asked as a question, not a statement - ruling?

People_Mover · #1 08-30-2007, 02:34 PM

2/5NL stacks irrelevant. After the river is dealt Player A bets 60.00, Player B raises to 200.00, Player A, says, "I'm all in", Player B responds "all in?" as a question, not a statement.

Ruling?

youtalkfunny · #2 08-30-2007, 02:47 PM

I say Player B just called.

The only reason I say that is, maybe he'll learn a lesson, and not allow the words "all-in" to come out of his mouth unless he wants to put all his chips in.

Rule this a call, and I'll bet the next time Player B is in this spot, he'll say something like, "Excuse me? I didn't quite hear you. Did you say that you were all-in?", or, "Is the action on me? Did he check or bet?"

youtalkfunny · #3 08-30-2007, 02:49 PM

Now that I'm through venting:

If no one has acted after Player B's incredibly poor choice of words, then the action is still on him.

If there's been action behind him--even if it's merely Player A tabling his hand--it's a little more complicated than that.

rbenuck4 · #4 08-30-2007, 02:51 PM

[ QUOTE ]
I say Player B just called.

The only reason I say that is, maybe he'll learn a lesson, and not allow the words "all-in" to come out of his mouth unless he wants to put all his chips in.

Rule this a call, and I'll bet the next time Player B is in this spot, he'll say something like, "Excuse me? I didn't quite hear you. Did you say that you were all-in?"

[/ QUOTE ]

In both examples, the words "all in" were spoken. What is the difference between the question "all in?" and the statement "did he say all in?" I rule that this was a question, and he should get an answer, he should not have to call here.

Gamblar2000 · #5 08-30-2007, 02:57 PM

I agree. I don't think he's required to call. If there was action after him, thats a different story. But if you are paying attention, its pretty obvious that a question is different from a statement.

jeffnc · #6 08-30-2007, 03:21 PM

[ QUOTE ]
In both examples, the words "all in" were spoken. What is the difference between the question "all in?" and the statement "did he say all in?"

[/ QUOTE ]

When you consider that the second phrase was a question also, not a statement, then not much.

AngusThermopyle · #7 08-30-2007, 03:27 PM

[ QUOTE ]
What is the difference between the question "all in?" and the statement "did he say all in?"

[/ QUOTE ]

Maybe the fact that we are dealing with the spoken word, not the written word.
Maybe the fact that the statement "All in." and the question "All in?" are very close in the spoken word, while easily distinguishable in the written word.
Maybe the fact that I can say "All in" as a statement, but change my mind and argue that I was asking a question, and it is next to impossible for the dealer or floor to know the truth.

diddyeinstein · #8 08-30-2007, 03:41 PM

[ QUOTE ]

Maybe the fact that I can say "All in" as a statement, but change my mind and argue that I was asking a question, and it is next to impossible for the dealer or floor to know the truth.

[/ QUOTE ]

I think this is the best reason why it should be treated as a call.

FireStorm · #9 08-30-2007, 04:12 PM

OT but if you are angle shooting for 1 BB in live 3/6 Limit, your life is pretty much a joke and you can have either SIXXXXXXXXX you want.

youtalkfunny · #10 08-30-2007, 06:22 PM

[ QUOTE ]
What is the difference between the question "all in?" and the statement "did he say all in?"

[/ QUOTE ]

The second one will never make someone think, "That guy who said those words just moved all-in."

When it's your turn to act, your first words should not be "call, raise, fold, etc" unless that's what you want to do. Everyone at the table is expecting you to announce your action. If you're going to say anything that is NOT your intended action, you should make sure that you don't say something that could be mistakenly interpreted as your intended action.

Or you could keep saying things like "All-in?". You can keep bringing the game to a halt while we argue about what to do, and you can hope that a floorman doesn't rule that you have to push all your chips in when you don't want to.