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  #11  
Old 11-27-2007, 03:32 PM
THoM. THoM. is offline
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Default Re: NL10 - QJs big draw on flop

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Preflop is fine, its pretty thin but I dont think its terrible. On the flop, I raise and get all in in whatever way possible, you are ahead of every ace except AK in which you have 43% equity, more than compensated for by the bloated pot. If your opponent has a PP lower than JJ you are massive with 15 outs and are an equity favourite. You called preflop to hit this exact board, so get your money in.

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I think calling the 3 bet is really bad. at this level people arent likely to 3bet you light, and you tend to get in a lot of really marginal situations, for example a q 8 2 flop, that you would be better off avoiding imo.

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I'm not playing QJs in a 3bet pot to flop TP/medium kicker. I would be able to get away from that. This was one of the flops I was looking for and could stack off on. But I dont know if this preflop call is profitable.
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  #12  
Old 11-27-2007, 03:40 PM
gumpzilla gumpzilla is offline
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Default Re: NL10 - QJs big draw on flop

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Preflop is fine, its pretty thin but I dont think its terrible. On the flop, I raise and get all in in whatever way possible, you are ahead of every ace except AK in which you have 43% equity, more than compensated for by the bloated pot. If your opponent has a PP lower than JJ you are massive with 15 outs and are an equity favourite. You called preflop to hit this exact board, so get your money in.

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I don't think this is bad, but there are two opponents, not one. I'm pretty happy getting my money in here, but I'm also pretty happy taking a cheap card if it is offered and getting money in on the later streets, since I think any hand that calls a shove on the flop will not fold if I hit my draw later. Since SB was the 3 bettor there is a strong chance he's going for a c/r, so this plan might not work. If it doesn't, then I go ahead and shove at that point. If I thought the raise on the flop would get As to fold, I might try that, but I think I'd rather hope for the cheap card at this level.
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  #13  
Old 11-27-2007, 03:44 PM
drsmooth drsmooth is offline
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Default Re: NL10 - QJs big draw on flop

I won't get into the pre-flop debate other than to say he isn't calling to hit top pair. He is calling to hit a board like this one. So get it in...
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  #14  
Old 11-27-2007, 03:58 PM
THoM. THoM. is offline
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Default Re: NL10 - QJs big draw on flop

@ gumpzilla:

What do you do if you call the $0,50 and the SB reraised to $2/$3 and the initial better calls?
Do you push / fold(?) / call?
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  #15  
Old 11-27-2007, 04:01 PM
bsball8806 bsball8806 is offline
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Default Re: NL10 - QJs big draw on flop

I'm not a big fan of calling with JQs to a reraise preflop, but at least you're in position against multiple opponents. You have to be able to dump it against any pressure on a J or Q high flop, though.

Raise flop and try to get AI as soon as possible
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  #16  
Old 11-27-2007, 04:10 PM
gumpzilla gumpzilla is offline
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Default Re: NL10 - QJs big draw on flop

[ QUOTE ]
@ gumpzilla:

What do you do if you call the $0,50 and the SB reraised to $2/$3 and the initial better calls?
Do you push / fold(?) / call?

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In the heat of the moment I might call, but in that spot neither guy is likely to fold and you probably have >33% equity in the pot, so just shoving at that point is probably good.
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  #17  
Old 11-27-2007, 04:14 PM
ev_slave ev_slave is offline
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Default Re: NL10 - QJs big draw on flop

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I'm getting around 4:1 PF, fold?



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I know that many others have discussed this, but PF with a hand like this you're looking to hit on the flop and play for stacks. Therefore, immediate odds aren't relevant. Think implied odds.

In this hand, there's 2.1 in the pot with 0.55 to call, but opponents have 9.32 left and 8.85 left. You have implied odds of ~20:1 against both of the players. I haven't done the math, but these seem like reasonable odds to hit your perfect flop. I don't mind the PF call IP.

On the flop, I agree with raise/call shove.
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