To the Multi-Accounters : some thoughts before this upcoming Sunday

[uclabruinz]

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I thought he said it was redsoxsox in another post and others confirmed it.

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He was banned as well.

[mflip]

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David,

I have been thinking about what I can do as a lawyer and if the right high-volume, high-stakes MTT player potential client were to contact me and want to pursue it, I would give it very serious thought. Would have to be a California resident though.

It would have to be similar to what DirecTV and the RIAA used to do to try to identify potential copyright pirates. They would file a lawsuit against one or more John or Jane Does, then supboena a third-party to identify the actual defendant. If a high-stakes regular were to sue John Does (claims could be conversion (i.e., theft), illegal business practices, probably others), they could issue subpoenas and haul those "in the know" into a deposition under oath.

Worth considering at least. The right private citizen with the right lawyer could probably blow the whole thing wide open.

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I have no legal training, but it does interest me so just for knowledge purposes, can a person be charged for any violation of the law (or i guess a site's TOC) based on a conversation which was not recorded in any fashion to prove what was said?

[uclabruinz]

mflip, I'm not going to get into legal discussions, and I almost never discuss law for that very reason. I probably shouldn't have even posted my thoughts, which were just sorta random "how can we out these cheaters" type stuff. There are numerous problems with bringing a lawsuit of this type that would have to be considered very carefully.

Anyway, so I'm not giving any legal advice here and I am not going to discuss law in general, sorry.

[valenzuela]

Not really surprised by the situation. I will keep playing the tournaments I play, bring on the multiaccounters.

If you are multiaccounter then I hate you and hope you die.
If you are on a circle of friends of multiaccounter and you dont turn them in then I hate you but I dont want you to die I just want you to grow some balls so that I can have more sklansky buxs on the donkaments I play.
If you stake people on the tourneys you are also playing and then once you bust you give advice I hate you. Yes I know its not on TOC but I dont care I still hate you, feel free to hate me back.

[mflip]

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mflip, I'm not going to get into legal discussions, and I almost never discuss law for that very reason. I probably shouldn't have even posted my thoughts, which were just sorta random "how can we out these cheaters" type stuff. There are numerous problems with bringing a lawsuit of this type that would have to be considered very carefully.

Anyway, so I'm not giving any legal advice here and I am not going to discuss law in general, sorry.

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Not a problem, I just thought it would be difficult to prove anything like this based upon "conversations". Even taking this to the courts is really extreme in my opinion and going through the poker sites would be as far as I'd ever take this if I knew of people who were doing it.

[burningyen]

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Redsoxsox got banned for multiaccounting.
It is common knowledge.

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First I've heard of it, and I'm a regular reader of MTTc and NVG.

[nath]

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Redsoxsox got banned for multiaccounting.
It is common knowledge.

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First I've heard of it, and I'm a regular reader of MTTc and NVG.

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Me too, and I'm both a regular MTT player and a gossip whore. I don't know what passes for common knowledge these days, but I never seem to have it.

[Ship Ship McGipp]

you guys talk a lot

[ActionJeff]

I think the whole "not turning in friends" thing has been blown way out of proportion. I have 2-3 friends who I know were regularly multi-accounting the past several weeks.
I know of several other people who also partake in this practice, who I either am not acquainted with, or in some cases actually dislike personally. I could turn those guys in and not even hurt many feelings! Someone compared multi-accounting to collusion, and if I felt that way I would be disgusted and it would be a huge scandal and everyone would be outed, but I don't feel that way and don't think such an outing would even greatly improve this situation in the long run. It didn't help that much before, and people are even better at it now then in the past. They would be back on their computers in the big MTTs within a few days.

Since I was not clear in earlier posts- yes, I am not giving names now. However, this IS a warning. A couple weeks from now if I see one of these guys still multi-accounting, that is a different story. And like I said, even if they change accounts and rarely talk about it- news travels, and people talk. I think making people aware of this and making clear it is not socially acceptable and exposure is very possible. People not feeling comfortable about the security of their accounts and who they can trust will help a lot in preventing multi-accounting.



Keep in mind, that I am well connected and only know of a handful of people who do this. Who knows what other groups of poker players multi-account? It would be great if the sites think of some ways to make life more difficult for these people.

-Jeff

[ActionJeff]

on the whole redsoxsox thing:

I was 3-handed with redsoxsox and opobi43 in a 100r. I ended up winning the tournament. The same thing happened a couple weeks later, and I once again won.

I had no suspicion at the time, but a few weeks later I heard that redsoxsox used the account "opobi43" on FTP, meaning they were friends with some sort of financial arrangement. This developement, along with the insane spewing these 2 would do with each other in 100r rebuy periods, sparked my suspicion.

I emailed Stars. They said they saw no indication of collusion and I was still not convinced but let it go after a few more failed emails.

Several months later I heard from a well connected online player who was staking opobi that he had been banned. That he was the equivalent of a notorious party player, every account connected to his had been investigated some banned, etc.

I emailed Stars asking about the situation again. They said redsoxsox and opobi had been banned for collusion, but didn't give any more details. Did I deserve compensation? I don't know. Did they collude in tournaments, against me? Just in the rebuy period? PokerStars wouldn't tell me, and maybe I don't understand the situation. But its the one time I've been unsatisfied with Stars' responses and investigation of a potential cheating situation.

-Jeff