88 out of position

bosoxfan · #1 11-12-2006, 12:00 PM

I run into this a lot and never know if i should stop firing. Is there a better line than this. I would fold to a raise but he just keeps calling. Villian is a TAG. Is this the right line for heads up to the flop? Is it a check fold the turn because we were 4 to the flop and him sticking around means I'm beat? Should I even 3 bet this pre flop? Any comments would be great. thanks

Limit Holdem Ring game
Limit: $3/$6
6 players
Converter

Pre-flop: (6 players) hero is SB with 8[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 8[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]
UTG raises, 2 folds, Button calls, hero 3-bets, BB calls, UTG calls, Button calls.

Flop: 6[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] T[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] K[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (12SB, 4 players)
hero bets, BB folds, UTG calls, Button folds.

Turn: 6[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (7BB, 2 players)
hero bets, UTG calls.

River: 7[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (9BB, 2 players)
hero bets, UTG calls.

Results:
Final pot: 11BB

Guruman · #2 11-12-2006, 12:17 PM

I tend to check and fold that river actually. when a tag utg raise just calls that flop and turn he's usually on his way to showdown with a pair.

He'll probably just check behind most of his losers and maybe a few of his Tx winners. He'll be betting his better tens and all of his kings, and is never folding those.

I'd be more inclined to keep firing if the flop was K75, so that it would be more likely that villain is calling down with a worse pair or ace high.

Kharlog · #3 11-12-2006, 01:00 PM

I'd check/fold river. Villain has huge pot odds on flop and may be peeling a lot of hands. If he calls that turn he prolly has a pair and has you beat.

giddyup · #4 11-12-2006, 01:09 PM

I don't mind the PFR too much, but I would seriously consider check-folding this flop rather than betting into 3 opponents on a drawy board with 2 overs.

hicherbie · #5 11-12-2006, 01:26 PM

check fold river > check call > bet

that bet will usually be called by a pair going to sd, which means its prob a pair better than yours.

StellarWind · #6 11-12-2006, 01:38 PM

The 3-bet with a coldcaller already in the pot is poor and the root cause of your postflop problems. The UTG PFR has an overpair or overcards so why are you eager to raise the stakes OOP? Quietly call the raise and let the postflop play come to you. The PFR will bet and you will get to act after the coldcaller which is a big advantage.

As actually played you are stuck with betting the flop and you did really well when only the PFR called. You may be beat but sometimes your pocket pair is higher than his and very often he is locked in with AQ/AJ/QJ. Might as well keep betting as the underpairs and big aces will pay you off and you will never see a free card when you are behind.

elffaw · #7 11-12-2006, 01:41 PM

Can we really expect the big UI aces to pay off the river? I want to check fold after he calls the turn.

Guruman · #8 11-12-2006, 01:45 PM

good to see you back in the mix Stellar.

elffaw · #9 11-12-2006, 01:45 PM

[ QUOTE ]
good to see you back in the mix Stellar.

[/ QUOTE ]

++

(Sorry for the junk post!)

Guruman · #10 11-12-2006, 01:47 PM

[ QUOTE ]
Can we really expect the big UI aces to pay off the river? I want to check fold after he calls the turn.

[/ QUOTE ]

I agree with this. I think a turn call signifies a hand that can compete with a T or K, as that's what we've repped so far in the hand.