NL: Why the hate on short buy-ins?

[ClubChamp04]

Short stackers are skilless nitwits, ban them from all sites ASAP. It must be tough waiting for AQ+ and pushing all in without risking anything and f'ing up all the action at the table. Try buying in for more than 20bb's sometime and we can play some real poker you fishcakes

[limitninja]

nothing funner
than hit and runner
with short stack
take your chips and put them in a rack

lol

[Nsight7]

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Short stackers are skilless nitwits, ban them from all sites ASAP. It must be tough waiting for AQ+ and pushing all in without risking anything and f'ing up all the action at the table. Try buying in for more than 20bb's sometime and we can play some real poker you fishcakes

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This sounds alot like "Quit f'in up MY game and let me play in a way that allows me to take your money instead of vice-versa".

[Dilznoofus]

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I seriously fail to see how this is bad for the game, that logic is total BS. Why do you think so many live games cap the Buyins so low? Because it is actually good for the game.

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There's a big difference between 20BB and 40-50BB. And in a live game even with a 50BB cap the stacks will get deeper because players don't just hit and run, move to another table and buy back in for 20BB.

FWIW I don't think short stackers are unethical. I just don't like them and do believe it's bad for the game. It's not just ratholers, but tight mediocre players who never seem to increase their stacks and therefore continue to tighten up the game as they struggle to double up. At microNL I run into a lot of these guys who are 6+ tabling. They sit around breaking even and making the games suck.

You're supposed to give action to get action, but 20BB shorties playing proper strategy only give action by moving in preflop with a narrow range, taking the fun out of the game for the fishy LAGs and loose passives.

[JLaw]

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I seriously fail to see how this is bad for the game, that logic is total BS. Why do you think so many live games cap the Buyins so low? Because it is actually good for the game.

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There's a big difference between 20BB and 40-50BB. And in a live game even with a 50BB cap the stacks will get deeper because players don't just hit and run, move to another table and buy back in for 20BB.

FWIW I don't think short stackers are unethical. I just don't like them and do believe it's bad for the game. It's not just ratholers, but tight mediocre players who never seem to increase their stacks and therefore continue to tighten up the game as they struggle to double up. At microNL I run into a lot of these guys who are 6+ tabling. They sit around breaking even and making the games suck.

You're supposed to give action to get action, but 20BB shorties playing proper strategy only give action by moving in preflop with a narrow range, taking the fun out of the game for the fishy LAGs and loose passives.

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And I think your last sentence may be why you don't like a short-stacker -- "taking the fun out of the game for the fishy LAGs and loose passives". While I'll acknowledge playing is fun; I'm more concerned with making money, particularly when short-stacking. While it seems like you're more motivated by the "fun" aspect.

Even so, I still disagree with your statement that it makes the game suck.

In general, I typically see 0-2 players per table that are observant enough to play correctly against a short stack opponent. They certainly tighten up when I'm in a pot, and I'm certainly more careful when they call my pre-flop raise.

However, that's often counterbalanced by those who have the mentality of "you only had XXX dollars, so why not play" where XXX is usually between 10 and 50 big-blinds. Getting no respect due to the size of your stack is about as good as it gets for a shortie.

When I made notes for short-stack play, those are the things I'm looking at -- what adjustments (if any) does the player make against a shortie. I'll avoid the former and feast on the latter.

Jeff

ps. I won't ask what you think of a 10BB min-buyin :-) They're out there, and they're good for a shortie too since you make money on the loose pre-flop call and the absurdly weak flop folds. How many 10-15BB pots I've taken down with a 3-5BB all-in "air" bet is just insane. I've only seen a few players adjust properly to a micro/tiny stack in a cash game.

[dragonystic]

wow, im really surprised so many people think shortstackers are 'bad for the game.' my ideal scenario is sitting with a full stack and having 5 shortstackers surrounding me. yum.

[xxSTWxx]

I've played both short and full stack - at the lower limits I've found 8 tabling NL100 with a short stack a very easy and profitable way to clear bonunes etc. But other times I want to just play 2/3 tables with a full stack, and then I'll try and avoid tables that have more than 2 short stacks, and I agree sometimes its annoying, especially when the short stack uses his advantage well.

The solution is very simple though - the sites just need to offer a % of tables where the only buy-in allowed is the max. I guess they don't want to do so though, as it might reduce their rake.

If enough people email Stars about it, they might implement it I guess....

[Innocentius]

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wow, im really surprised so many people think shortstackers are 'bad for the game.' my ideal scenario is sitting with a full stack and having 5 shortstackers surrounding me. yum.

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If all other players are shortstacks, aren't you also effectively shortstacked?

[Better Than U]

It's just a bunch of internet tough guys that can't stand playing against shortstacks that can't stand not getting their way. They should all be shot.

ps: i read no replies, just answering the question, besides who the [censored] cares. Everybody is entitled to their opinion.

[soah]

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wow, im really surprised so many people think shortstackers are 'bad for the game.' my ideal scenario is sitting with a full stack and having 5 shortstackers surrounding me. yum.

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When I see a table with a bunch of shortstacks I will join it without a second thought. Almost all of them are simply giving away money. It amazes me that winning players actually want to chase away these cash cows.