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#1
10-26-2007, 06:19 PM
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Re: Not convinced KK all-in preflop up to 100BB is good idea (at $0.50
when do you ever face overbets?? facing pot odds 7:6???
having KK and beeing pushed directly after a threebet is SO unlikely in low stakes.. OPs point was to fold KK as a default you are making up some rare situations where it might be correct. the "never fold KK" is a simplification of a general rule. a low stakes player WILL NOT be able to seperate the spots where to fold KK from the ones where he shouldn't as proved by OP. if you are good enough to separate them you will be on NL100 and up so it won't really matter anymore thats why the statement exists and it should be applied by any not so good player because they do the math wrong and fold KK after they 4bet for example 
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#2
10-26-2007, 06:47 PM
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Re: Not convinced KK all-in preflop up to 100BB is good idea (at $0.50
[ QUOTE ]
when do you ever face overbets?? facing pot odds 7:6??? [/ QUOTE ] I've had it happen many times, and many people have posted about it. Look up "move of honor." See this thread, this thread, this thread, this thread, etc. [ QUOTE ] OPs point was to fold KK as a default [/ QUOTE ] He said it looks like KK loses money when it gets all-in preflop with stacks over about 60 BB. That is very, very different from saying to fold it, for reasons I have already pointed out. [ QUOTE ] a low stakes player WILL NOT be able to seperate the spots where to fold KK from the ones where he shouldn't [/ QUOTE ] Low stakes players aren't allowed to be thinking players? It looks like many are trying. You better go tell them to stop.
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#3
10-26-2007, 07:05 PM
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Re: Not convinced KK all-in preflop up to 100BB is good idea (at $0.50
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] when do you ever face overbets?? facing pot odds 7:6??? [/ QUOTE ] I've had it happen many times, and many people have posted about it. Look up "move of honor." See this thread, this thread, this thread, this thread, etc. [ QUOTE ] OPs point was to fold KK as a default [/ QUOTE ] He said it looks like KK loses money when it gets all-in preflop with stacks over about 60 BB. That is very, very different from saying to fold it, for reasons I have already pointed out. [ QUOTE ] a low stakes player WILL NOT be able to seperate the spots where to fold KK from the ones where he shouldn't [/ QUOTE ] Low stakes players aren't allowed to be thinking players? It looks like many are trying. You better go tell them to stop. [/ QUOTE ] meh, this is a scenario where having info may be worse than having none. there have been some threads in msnl/hsnl where the consensus was to fold kk pf, but they involved deep stacks and/or pristine reads/history.
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#4
10-26-2007, 07:10 PM
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Re: Not convinced KK all-in preflop up to 100BB is good idea (at $0.50
u are taking the farha greenstein thing a little too seriously, the picture was an extreme version of the joke to never fold. No one is advising anything above 100bb.
and gonzo i agree, but how can this kind of statistic be found and put together? Maybe we can get pokey on the job
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#5
10-26-2007, 08:44 PM
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Re: Not convinced KK all-in preflop up to 100BB is good idea (at $0.50
You'd have to filter out everything but KK hands that CALLED preflop, then we'd have to address the $ that you'd find in the pot already. You'd have to separate them by limit, then there's all kinds of things like table image and whatnot, so it's not really easy and would require a lot of data.
On a side note, I think a more useful discussion would relate to AK in this spot rather than KK.
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