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#1
10-18-2007, 07:27 PM
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AJ on BTN c/r small on turn.
MP1 has 2k stacks, Me and BB have 3k, blinds 10/20.
MP1 raises to 60, folds to hero who calls on BTN w/ AJo, BB also calls. Flop: Pot(190) A K 2[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] rainbow BB checks, MP1 Bets 60, Hero calls, BB calls. Turn: (370) 9[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] MP1 checks, Hero bets 195, MP1 raises 205 to 400, Hero? Looks like an insta fold, but really, who plays AA/KK/AK this way? That leaves 22 and AQ and air. Thoughts? 
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#2
10-18-2007, 08:51 PM
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Re: AJ on BTN c/r small on turn.
I don't like the turn bet much at all, and I guess you have to fold here, RIO and whatnot. However, the point is that this hand plays like 10x better if you check behind here then pick off river bets or vb the river yourself, since he'll call a lot wider on the river than he would on the turn. Sure, occasionally he'll draw out on the river, but that seems like a minor consequence compared to controlling the size of the pot here and trying to keep villain's range full of hands you beat.
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#3
10-18-2007, 11:28 PM
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Re: AJ on BTN c/r small on turn.
/thread.
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#4
10-19-2007, 12:52 PM
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Re: AJ on BTN c/r small on turn.
[ QUOTE ]
I don't like the turn bet much at all, and I guess you have to fold here, RIO and whatnot. However, the point is that this hand plays like 10x better if you check behind here then pick off river bets or vb the river yourself, since he'll call a lot wider on the river than he would on the turn. Sure, occasionally he'll draw out on the river, but that seems like a minor consequence compared to controlling the size of the pot here and trying to keep villain's range full of hands you beat. [/ QUOTE ] i agree for the most part, esp RIO stuff. but there is some weird stuff going on here. what happened to the BB? flop indicates he called the bet of 60 and then he seemingly disappears on turn. It seems that villain is now facing this turn with 2 other villains in the hand and the board is now pretty wet. We have diamond draws, gut shot SDs and other scare cards, Qs, Ks, 9s etc. hero also has both villains checking to him likely holding the best hand, given the action. so i think heros bet is almost perfect under the circumstances to keep the pot fairly small but also protect. with that in mind, like dunk said, there are merits to checking behind as well. its a tough spot. as played i fold to the c/r.
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#5
10-19-2007, 02:01 PM
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Re: AJ on BTN c/r small on turn.
Why is the fold to the c/r such an easy decision? The villain's actions really don't make a lot of sense, do they? I guess betting 1/3 of the pot on the flop and checking the turn might be a sign that he has a really strong hand and doesn't mind keeping people around, but if we're applying that level of logic here then I would expect a call on the turn instead of the CR.
I think I would have checked the turn here too to try to keep the pot small, but as played, can we really put Villain on a hand range good enough that we can't call the turn raise? The pot is 965 and its 205 to call, and we'll have position on the river of course. Given the somewhat erratic play, and assuming this is early in a small stakes MTT vs a total unknown, I have a really hard time putting my opponent on a hand, but I don't know if I have a reason yet to believe that this guy has me so crushed that I have to fold with 4.7:1 odds. Call here, be willing to call a small bet on the river, let him have it if he makes a big bet, hope that he's weak and you can check it down. Am I crazy?
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#7
10-19-2007, 02:14 PM
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Re: AJ on BTN c/r small on turn.
RIO = ?? thanks
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#8
10-19-2007, 03:40 PM
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Re: AJ on BTN c/r small on turn.
Reverse implied odds.
I challenge the people who say call to put villain on a hand that we beat that plays this way on this board, and come up with a plan for the river...how big of a bet before we fold? Surely we can't fold to a 500 bet getting 3:1 (and calling a bet this size gives us actual odds of 2.2:1 on calling the turn bet just fyi,) so when can we fold on the river? And will the hands making big river bets actually be the ones we're behind?
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#9
10-19-2007, 03:53 PM
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Re: AJ on BTN c/r small on turn.
[ QUOTE ]
MP1 has 2k stacks, Me and BB have 3k, blinds 10/20. MP1 raises to 60, folds to hero who calls on BTN w/ AJo, BB also calls. Flop: Pot(190) A K 2[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] rainbow BB checks, MP1 Bets 60, Hero calls, BB calls. Turn: (370) 9[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] MP1 checks, Hero bets 195, MP1 raises 205 to 400, Hero? Looks like an insta fold, but really, who plays AA/KK/AK this way? That leaves 22 and AQ and air. Thoughts? [/ QUOTE ] don't forget the might A 2 and A 9
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#10
10-19-2007, 06:38 PM
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Re: AJ on BTN c/r small on turn.
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] MP1 has 2k stacks, Me and BB have 3k, blinds 10/20. MP1 raises to 60, folds to hero who calls on BTN w/ AJo, BB also calls. Flop: Pot(190) A K 2[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] rainbow BB checks, MP1 Bets 60, Hero calls, BB calls. Turn: (370) 9[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] MP1 checks, Hero bets 195, MP1 raises 205 to 400, Hero? Looks like an insta fold, but really, who plays AA/KK/AK this way? That leaves 22 and AQ and air. Thoughts? [/ QUOTE ] don't forget the might A 2 and A 9 [/ QUOTE ] Yeah,no kidding,this could so easily be A 9. Random nobody? Honestly didn't think of that until ssnyc's post here,but that hand makes so much sense.
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