The psycology of tilt

[DaycareInferno]

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What is the premise of it ?

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i just don't agree with the idea that tilt is largely a nonemotional, mechanical response to being down money. obviously that is a natural and common response, but to say that it is not an emotional response, well, i don't agree.

[blue10cj]

tilt is hell

[Gelford]

Well if you've ever worked in a callcenter (as I have), then there is the fun issue of

1. Being on the clock (your calls are supposed to not last long (perhaps max 1 min)

2. Having to sell something to the people that call your 'service desk' (despite there to help people, you are supposed to sell stuff naturally)


And then the icing on the cake


3. Customers calling you are either pissed to start of with or prone to getting pissed, since they hate callcenter employees.



The stuff I learned about tilt there (both presented as theory and thru practice) kicked any poker litteratures presentation big time.

Unfortunately pokerlitterature is written by pokerplayer or Dr. Al, who obviously gets a kick out of being condesending, but offers little in terms of insight unfortunately.

[DaycareInferno]

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wow - really good article and well thought out. I really agree with you on how you broke this down.. I find it interesting that in Live play I'am excellent at controlling my emotions while during online play I become much more prone to tilt. I'm currently trying to find a connection from my live game that can help me fix this in my online game. Maybe looking up other resources like you advise will help out. good post.

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i think a lot of people are like that when it comes to live/online play. maybe the reason is that online you have a higher level of anonymity, whereas live, there's a much higher embarrassment factor. maybe its easier in general. to hate someone that you don't have to sit face-to-face with.

[Gelford]

The thing is, that is it a primal instinct we all have inside of us.

You see, when man still has on the missing link level, then danger really meant danger! You know a tiger jumping out of the bushes ... in other words a matter of LIFE AND DEATH.


So under pressure we tend to fall back into that, which is good in the jungle, or depending on what result you wish for, then dealing with other people (go balistic on them)

Poker on the other hand does not award this sort of behavior, it punishes it. (unlike for example chess), the card just fall as they do and you applying pressure only induce even ligther calls from villians.


I for one do not believe that you can just tell yourself to not tilt, nor can you control it at first. Imho there is nothing else to do than internalize it be aware of what is happening, think it over .. rinse wash and repeat. Then after a while it goes from the subconsious to the consious and you start to cope with it.

That is my take on tilt, been wanting to make a post about it for long, but never got around to it

[well named]

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i just don't agree with the idea that tilt is largely a nonemotional, mechanical response to being down money.


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I wasn't actually trying to imply that all tilt was largely a result of purely psychological factors only involving perceived loss, and I don't think that the article is either. Instead, I think the article points out that this phenomenon is both a contributing factor to why we get emotionally upset in some cases, and how more subtle kinds of tilt can occur even when we don't believe we are emotionally upset.

I think all the points about anger management and dealing with emotional issues that you make are quite valid as well. In fact, you might divide tilt issues into a few rough categories:

1) Tilt from perceived loss. This is what is mainly discussed in the article, and the normally prescribed method of overcoming this is to train yourself to evaluate your play in terms of expectation and decision making, rather than results. As far as the emotional impact of loss, I also think it generally becomes less with experience, and if you are practicing sound bankroll management.

2) Related to (1) is the tendency to project onto your opponents and get angry with them for sucking out, or making some play ("How could you call there???"). I say it's related because it's the perceived loss that motivates the projection, but I think, as the OP points out, if you have the tendency in the rest of your life to get angry at other people in certain situations, than that may increase your likelihood of tilting in this way as well.

3) Tilt from external emotional instability or stress. That is, you're mad at the world and trying to take it out on the donks, more or less.

I agree with you when you say that dealing with emotional health aspects of 2 and 3 requires a great deal of commitment, and really impacts your life way beyond poker. I also think that even for those who are generally fairly stable with regard to (2) and (3), the psychological aspects of risk aversion talked about in the article are worth being aware of.

[DaycareInferno]

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The thing is, that is it a primal instinct we all have inside of us.

You see, when man still has on the missing link level, then danger really meant danger! You know a tiger jumping out of the bushes ... in other words a matter of LIFE AND DEATH.


So under pressure we tend to fall back into that, which is good in the jungle, or depending on what result you wish for, then dealing with other people (go balistic on them)

Poker on the other hand does not award this sort of behavior, it punishes it. (unlike for example chess), the card just fall as they do and you applying pressure only induce even ligther calls from villians.


I for one do not believe that you can just tell yourself to not tilt, nor can you control it at first. Imho there is nothing else to do than internalize it be aware of what is happening, think it over .. rinse wash and repeat. Then after a while it goes from the subconsious to the consious and you start to cope with it.

That is my take on tilt, been wanting to make a post about it for long, but never got around to it

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i think that you're right, at least when it comes to the short term. there really isn't much you can effectively do, short of evasion that's going to be effective, and if you're not thinking rationally, you're less likely to even do that.

i also pretty much have hated almost everything i've ever read on the subject. it was usually just like watching an episode of doctor phil. i'm usually just sitting there thinking "well, you're right of course, but tell me something i don't know, you [censored]"

i think that in the long term, a person really can get much better at managing their tilt response, so long as that person has some sort of handle on what's going on, acknowledges it, and makes a long term effort at reconditioning themselves. i think that's where most people get hung up. winning is their cure, and as soon as that happens, poof, problem solved! well, not so much.

[EasyAs1-2-3]

"The accrual of gains and losses reside in the mind, not the wallet. This is a powerful concept"

This is a big one for me. As a recovering and still part-time tilt monkey the thing that would set me off the most would be checking my acct balance or PT stats for the day during the session. This is suicide. Not only does it distract you but it cements that you have actually LOST xxx dollars, which takes you from upset to steamed. One truly does need to convince themselves their is no real money ever being made or lost until a withdrawal or deposit is made. It's like putting money in the markets - they might fluctuate but you don't make or lose any money until the shares are actually sold for a profit or a loss.

On another note I get tilted off bad plays of my own, not bad beats. Bad beats are fine, they happen and we just hope they don't happen for more than 100BB. When I get 2outered for 50BBs I'm happy, cuz it wasn't a whole stack. Mistakes of my own are what send me off the deep end b/c in poker we're not in control of winning money, we're only in control of making the correct decisions to maximize our potential of making money. Thus we construe this as failure.

On another note - "Your favorite football team throws an interception in the last minute of a close game that is returned for a game winning score by the opposing team."
I'm sorry but if this does not elicit a violent and emotional response, you are a complete cupcake and have no business claiming to be a real fan.

Anyways, good post OP.

[Gelford]

Yeah, most written is bull ... btw without ever having played live, I suspect that there is the twist, that are staring your 'Enemy' in the eye.

In other words you are in known waters, and you can quickly dertermine, that you can take him man to man or something. The lack or an enemy proper online is what I'm guessing is causing tilt to escalate .. dunno, but it's my guess.

[well named]

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I for one do not believe that you can just tell yourself to not tilt, nor can you control it at first. Imho there is nothing else to do than internalize it be aware of what is happening, think it over .. rinse wash and repeat. Then after a while it goes from the subconsious to the consious and you start to cope with it.

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I think this is right on.