I fold em cuz im hawt

[invisibleleadsoup]

are there really that many 2/4 players who are capable of betting this river,getting raised and shoving as a bluff?

[9cao]

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isnt this a fold pflop?

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nope

but sure I mean it can be fold yes if ur going too far with it postflop , but this hand is def > his range

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You have no clue than as to what a 16 pfr opens UTG then. It is a CLEAR fold PF and a CLEAR bet on the flop.

[emil3000]

everyone always have it fold

[LucidDream]

who is villain?

[jlkrusty]

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are there really that many 2/4 players who are capable of betting this river,getting raised and shoving as a bluff?

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Good point. But, the way hero played looks very suspiscious. It looks like hero had a draw or a weak hand (KJ, AsJs, etc) and that hero is now trying to steal the pot. If villain is putting hero on a weak hand, then it's harder to know what villain's all in shove means.

Villain could have something like J9s, KJ, etc., but think there is no way we have a Q. Even still, you are right that not that many players will shove all in as a bluff here. However, if I thought this villain was the exception and capable of bluffing all in, then I'd probably call. If I did not know villain well enough, then I'd probably go with the default presumption and fold.

[CopTHIS]

There is no history mentioned so they almost always have it here, let's face it. You can argue that most of the hands that beat us wouldn't often play it this way (other that a turned set I guess), but you see bluffs in this spot so rarely you can't expect to good much at all. And when I say much, I mean hardly ever.

I'd fold PF, bet the flop sometimes but not a huge percentahe of the time, and often just call the river.

[MatthewRyan]

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isnt this a fold pflop?

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nope

but sure I mean it can be fold yes if ur going too far with it postflop , but this hand is def > his range

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You have no clue than as to what a 16 pfr opens UTG then. It is a CLEAR fold PF and a CLEAR bet on the flop.

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actauly i have a very good idea of the range, I can play well postflop and am not going to go too far in a reverse implied odds situation.

THat being said, preflop discussion sucks cuz we make money postflop

[MatthewRyan]

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i also bet flop 80%

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bah, thought that said 100% as well

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as for this point, I bet flop about 80/20, this was a time based on image/ game flow/ etc that checking was better

[Jinx]

flop check is fine, river fold is fine without history.

[fringsrache]

i fold this pf fwiw.
i bet flop fwiw
and i flat the river ...fwiw