***Official 2007-2008 MLB Offseason Thread*** - Page 14

Vyse · #**131** 11-27-2007, 04:49 PM

1. lol
2. it's a good thing you get more than one year of him. and for the yankees and sox it most likely is.

there's no pitcher in baseball who is as likely as santana to be an elite performer for the next five years. that's worth almost any price to pay. and considering we're talking about the best pitcher in baseball, not just "any" performer...

wisehandpoker · #**132** 11-27-2007, 04:55 PM

On 1, there are arguments to be made concerning declining stats and Josh Beckett. Just floating the question though.

Vyse · #**133** 11-27-2007, 04:56 PM

Not very many reasonable ones, unless you like to tremendously overrate one season and ignore things like consistency and never getting injured and pitching a lot of innings.

rwperu34 · #**134** 11-27-2007, 05:05 PM

[ QUOTE ]
I just think with the CF/DH/3B/2B situation they have, they shouldn't be looking to improve a position where they already have a league-average player. Right now, given in-house talent, they might be able to swing a league-average platoon at one of those 4 positions with the other 3 all being significantly below average.

[/ QUOTE ]

Casilla is a strength at 2B. He should be league average or better with his on base skills, speed, and defense. He's basically Luis Castillo with the potential to be the young Luis Castillo. No matter what, the Twins will not be looking for a 2B.

rwperu34 · #**135** 11-27-2007, 05:06 PM

[ QUOTE ]
Is it me, or are the preliminary offers for Santana really low?

The Twins have opened trade discussions for Johan Santana by asking the Yankees for a package of at least three young players that would include one of their three top starters -- Joba Chamberlain, Phil Hughes or Ian Kennedy -- plus center fielder Melky Cabrera.

The Twins are talking with several teams and are asking for a large return for their two-time Cy Young winner. From Boston, they asked about one of two top young pitchers -- Clay Buchholz or Jon Lester -- plus center field prodigy Jacoby Ellsbury, league sources told SI.com.

Dude, Lester + Ellsbury? Done in a second. Hughes + Cabrera? SIGN ME UP WTF?!?! This is not a lot for the best pitcher in baseball.

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I've actually thought the offers to be too high, but I haven't heard either of those rumors. I think the Ellsbury/Lester deal is one that could happen if there were a low level/high ceiling prospect as well. The problem is, I don't see the Red Sox dropping 6/150 on Johan, and that package is too much for a one year rental. My guess is, the only team that can realistically trade for Santana as more than a one year rental is the Yankees, and that's why I think the best the Twins are going to do is Wang, Cabrera, and a low level/high ceiling prospect. If I'm the Yankees, I hold on to the ceilings of Hughes and Chamberlain, mostly because I can.

wisehandpoker · #**136** 11-27-2007, 05:11 PM

meh, he's turning 29 in the offseason and his numbers are trending downwards (granted, not drastically) to the point where he's come back to the pack a bit. With both Beckett and CC's numbers trending the other direction and being two years younger, it's feasible they'll be better investments. Santana's probably still the best, but two years ago I wouldn't have thought to question it. I just don't think he's the 2004 johan any more.

By the way, was there any noticable change in Santana's peripheral numbers that would explain the sudden increase in HRs allowed this year?

edit: One other consideration: While I'd rather have Johan for the regular season, I can't say I choose him to pitch the one-game playoff game for my life over Beckett. If the decision makers feel the same way, that has to be a consideration for teams like the Yanks/Sox, for whom making the playoffs isn't enough. Am I off in any of this?

rwperu34 · #**137** 11-27-2007, 05:16 PM

A few rumors floating around.

This one a reader from a blog heard on the radio, so it's dubious at best. The deal does make a little sense, so I'll pass it along. The Twins are supposedly going to ship Justin Morneau to the Angels for Ervin Santana and Casey Kotchman.

Chris Lubanski has been left unprotected for the Rule V draft. He's still a little raw, but toolsy enough that he might be able to handle CF in 2008. Tampa Bay won't draft him unless it's to trade, but he could end up starting in CF for Pittsburgh, Baltimore, Florida, or San Fran.

"Things are heating up" between the Twins and Red Sox for Coco Crisp. Unfortunately, no mention of who'd be going the other way. I wonder if the other rumor has anything to do with this rumor?

rwperu34 · #**138** 11-27-2007, 05:19 PM

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the way, was there any noticable change in Santana's peripheral numbers that would explain the sudden increase in HRs allowed this year?

[/ QUOTE ]

No.

wisehandpoker · #**139** 11-27-2007, 05:19 PM

[ QUOTE ]
A few rumors floating around.

This one a reader from a blog heard on the radio, so it's dubious at best. The deal does make a little sense, so I'll pass it along. The Twins are supposedly going to ship Justin Morneau to the Angels for Ervin Santana and Casey Kotchman.

[/ QUOTE ]

How could the Yanks not trump this offer? Seems unlikely.

Vyse · #**140** 11-27-2007, 05:50 PM

How could they? Kotchman is good. Santana is decent. The Yanks don't have many MLB-ready players to offer.

I don't see how or why the Sox wouldn't go 150/6 with Johan.

People are really overrating pitching prospects.