debate

ship it pls · #1 10-11-2007, 02:41 PM

this is quick debate between myself and a lurker who was hero in this line...

6 handed game, villain is non-thinking laggy/payoff type and hero has not played many hands thus far...

villain raises in late position, hero 3-bets 77 from bb, villain calls...

flop: JT9, hero bets villain calls
turn: 7, hero bets, villain raises
river: Q, hero? b/f or c/c was our debate, thanks for the input

ignore all other streets except river, its just debate regarding that spot not the entire line...

The Dude · #2 10-11-2007, 02:46 PM

Bet/folding is better than check/calling.

jkamowitz · #3 10-11-2007, 02:49 PM

[ QUOTE ]
Bet/folding is better than check/calling.

[/ QUOTE ]

Much better in this spot.

MitchL · #4 10-11-2007, 02:51 PM

It depends on what you mean by non thinking. Do you mean he never gets creative or that he is capable of spazzing on the big streets, but out of desperation rather than logic.

p4594spa · #5 10-11-2007, 03:01 PM

I would be also interested in your 3 bet preflop. Is Villain's range wide enough that pocket 7's beats a good part of it? I am assuming u would just call in the BB against TAGs...

Yads · #6 10-11-2007, 03:04 PM

Yeah bet fold seems good.

KitCloudkicker · #7 10-11-2007, 03:08 PM

[ QUOTE ]
Bet/folding is better than check/calling.

[/ QUOTE ]

i never thought of this, but its brilliant. nh TheDude.

seems i learn something new about poker every week on 2+2.

ship it pls · #8 10-11-2007, 03:09 PM

my assumption is that the 3 bet preflop isnt because we are greatly ahead of the range but simply to make the hand easier to play... my non-thinking description is probably a bit vague, i mean he doesnt think about the game outside of the game and probably has no idea why we bet or check specific cards... he plays his cards

piggity · #9 10-11-2007, 03:12 PM

[ QUOTE ]
I would be also interested in your 3 bet preflop. Is Villain's range wide enough that pocket 7's beats a good part of it? I am assuming u would just call in the BB against TAGs...

[/ QUOTE ]

Not sure if this is a level, but 77 is a monster in a 6-handed game against a late position raiser.

danspartan · #10 10-11-2007, 03:18 PM

Villian raises on turn when the 7 hits? The only hand that helps villian with the 7 contains an 8(or a really bizarre two pair).

So, villian likely flopped a straight, a larger set or two pair and decided to slow play (yes he might slow play two pair if he's really non-thinking)

If he's laggy a pocket pair gets re-raised before the flop.

I think two pair is likely enough here that folding an 8BB pot seems silly against a live non-thinking player.

So if we get 9:1 to c/c and we are much less than 50/50 we are ahead and villain may continue to raise 2 pair--isnt c/c better than b/f? b/c seems spewy to me. If two pair, it might be a free showdown.