2 Q9 hands

midnightpulp · #1 09-16-2007, 04:35 AM

PokerStars 0.50/1.00 Hold'em (5 handed) Hand History Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com (Format: 2+2 Forums)

Preflop: Hero is SB with 9[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], Q[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img].
UTG calls, MP calls, 1 fold, Hero completes, BB raises, UTG calls, MP calls, Hero calls.

Flop: (8 SB) 9[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], 3[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], K[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (4 players)
Hero checks, BB bets, UTG folds, MP folds, Hero calls.

Turn: (5 BB) 6[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (2 players)
Hero checks, BB bets, Hero calls.

River: (7 BB) 8[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (2 players)
Hero checks, BB checks.

Final Pot: 7 BB

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Do you guys like the donk? MPair OOP remains the hardest spot in HE.

PokerStars 0.50/1.00 Hold'em (6 handed) Hand History Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com (Format: 2+2 Forums)

Preflop: Hero is BB with Q[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], 9[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img].
UTG raises, 2 folds, Button calls, SB calls, Hero calls.

Flop: (8 SB) A[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], Q[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], 7[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (4 players)
SB checks, Hero bets, UTG folds, Button folds, SB calls.

Turn: (5 BB) 3[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (2 players)
SB checks, Hero bets, SB calls.

River: (7 BB) A[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (2 players)
SB checks, Hero checks.

Final Pot: 7 BB

rzk · #2 09-16-2007, 06:30 AM

hand 1. standard imo.

hand 2. flop i c/c. i think donking is a big mistake because your hand is very weak. the rest is fine.

Fluffy_Shark · #3 09-16-2007, 06:34 AM

I'd muck Q9o in the SB (as in the first hand). is that bad?

-Fluffy_Shark

rzk · #4 09-16-2007, 06:37 AM

you mean before or after you complete?

not completing with Q9o would be a mistake. folding after BB raises is ok if BB is passive pf.

Fluffy_Shark · #5 09-16-2007, 06:45 AM

no I meant that I don't complete. I know that my equity is good but I am often dominated and have the worst position. I want to avoid situations like the one in hand 1 where you flop a pair but there are 2 overcards and you have no idea where you stand...

rzk · #6 09-16-2007, 07:02 AM

in hand 1 there's only one overcard. you shouldn't be afraid of these situations. Q9o is a decent holding with straight possibilities, definitely worth completing.

midnightpulp · #7 09-16-2007, 07:22 AM

[ QUOTE ]
I'd muck Q9o in the SB (as in the first hand). is that bad?

-Fluffy_Shark

[/ QUOTE ]

Coming from fullring, it used to be an auto-muck for me, but after spending some time here, I routinely see hands where posters call with hands as low J8off.

Check out my hand "vs 2+2er". He called with 97off in the SB after I raised.

midnightpulp · #8 09-16-2007, 07:26 AM

[ QUOTE ]
hand 1. standard imo.

hand 2. flop i c/c. i think donking is a big mistake because your hand is very weak. the rest is fine.

[/ QUOTE ]

Yeah, I don't really like my donk. My reasoning was that the raiser could have JJ-66 or something like KJ, KTs. So I bet out to determine where I was at.

Fluffy_Shark · #9 09-16-2007, 08:11 AM

sure, I'd complete and call the raise with 97o without thinking about it but I'd still muck Q9o. Is that stupid? maybe but I don't want to spike a queen and get owned. I think RIOs are huge...

midnightpulp · #10 09-16-2007, 09:09 AM

I'm still learning 6max, so I'm not completely sure if it's "correct" to call a raise with Q9o.

Looking back, it was probably a mistake in this instance given that the raise came from the BB.

You're right, it's a RIO nightmare. It's impossible to play effectively after the flop OOP.

When you flop a middle pair and are staring at 3 other players, how on earth can you figure out the best line?
It's not as easy a decision as is in full ring, where a middle pair is usually dead multiway. Middle pair surprisingly holds up well in these games. I can't tell you how many times I've called a raise with something like QJs, the flop comes AJx. I peel and brick, then fold. A calling station looks the raiser up and takes it down with 9J against the raiser's 77.

I know I'm being a little results oriented, but I've seen some marginal hands take it down in raised pots.

Obviously, you need to have a stone solid read on your opponent to play these hands profitably. If he's the type to brick off with middle pockets on a board that has an A or paint, you could look up him.