weak or expert

[CardSharpCook]

yeah, that makes a bit of a difference, but not much. It increases your range a little (but not much) You're less likely to be capping AK, but you might be 4 betting it (on the flop). AQ [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] is still likely. Random guy still has 66, KK, AA, AK, and I suppose he could have Ax[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img].

The result is essentially the same, it is one bet to us on the turn with a reasonable chance that we are chopping (one or two ways is unknown) and it should only cost us 2BB to find out. Sadly, we must fold if it is 2BB back to us.

On the other hand.... we could probably fold out the 2p2er's AK if we raise here.... We'd also quickly find out if random guy has AA/KK/66 as he's 3betting here with those hands (probably not 66) and just calling AK at this point. While it is safe to fold to a 3bet, I probably call down anyway, but then, I earned this custom title.

[gaming_mouse]

[ QUOTE ]
Mitch, all,

you're aware that if one of them has AK, the other can have neither AA nor KK? So we're going for the parlay of 66 AND AA/KK OR AA AND KK. The other possibility is AK and AQ[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]. The odds are too great. I need to get to SD here.

[/ QUOTE ]

Or KK and AQ[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]
Maybe even AA and KQ[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]
Some others if SB happened to be feeling a bit too loose.

I think this is a case where the postflop action needs to be weighted more than the pure combos.

[ship it pls]

thanks for the clarification banana, good to know your board name too - that makes more sense, i 4-bet preflop and you donk/4bet from the sb and the solid player capped preflop and 2bet/capped flop... here are a few other notes about the hand...

i have the nut spade, so nobody has AsQs and here are the general ranges i put them on after the preflop action:

2p2: TT+, AQs+ - no history with this fella

solid: 55+, AJs+, AKo - he likes to cap multiway similarly to howmany; however, he plays very abc poker post flop and does not get out of line in big pots

thanks for the input, help that stirs the pot

also, what do we think 2p2 is doing with his 4-bet flop and check turn, i had 3 thoughts at the time... can we put QsJs in his range, or do we think he got scared from the solid players flop cap, or is he going for the ol check and raise trick? thanks for the notes

[hoppscot22]

you are probably chopping with dave... but im not sure why he checked the turn...

he doesnt have AQ, doesnt have 66.

I think he has AK.

[MitchL]

[ QUOTE ]
Mitch, all,

you're aware that if one of them has AK, the other can have neither AA nor KK? So we're going for the parlay of 66 AND AA/KK OR AA AND KK. The other possibility is AK and AQ[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]. The odds are too great. I need to get to SD here.

[/ QUOTE ]

I was kind of trying to make that point, albeit badly. This is all dependent on villains. Even though the action is wrong the original situation is much more interesting. If Dave played it this way I would call down knowing that at least 1 AK was out and praying that the other guy doesnt have 66.

[ship it pls]

since i have the nut spade, the way i figured it there were 6 hand combinations given the play thus far: (2p2:Solid)
AK:AK
AK:66
KK:AA
KK:66
AA:KK
AA:66

three big potential problems:
1) 2p2 c/r
2) folding 3 way chop in 23bb pot
3) drawing dead

what do we think about calling 1 more on the turn and folding if 2p2 c/r? or do we call down the additional c/r because it still could be AK - only fold if solid makes it 3?

[MitchL]

I just cant imagine folding in this pot. Dave never has 66 and if solid player is really solid he wont either so just get to sd.

[hoppscot22]

Dave never has AA/KK/66 he has AK i hope...

if he has anything else dave needs talk some more shop with me

[ship it pls]

i dont think 66 is an option for dave, but KK/AA definitely are imo and solid player may have 66, i qualified his capping range a bit because he plays more tightly post flop and laggier pre... i called him solid simply because most everyone else at the table was awful

[MitchL]

[ QUOTE ]
i dont think 66 is an option for dave, but KK/AA definitely are imo and solid player may have 66, i qualified his capping range a bit because he plays more tightly post flop and laggier pre... i called him solid simply because most everyone else at the table was awful

[/ QUOTE ]

Ive played quite a bit w/ Dave and I dont think he would mess around in a multiway pot w/ AA or KK. I could be wrong and he has played KK slow against me though that was head up. If solid-player has 66 here then he is beyond lag and closer to mentally ill.