Calldown?

[ILOVEPOKER929]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]


I think whenever were against someone who is good enough to know what our flop call means, check/raising will usually be the better route.

[/ QUOTE ]

Ya, Dean's narration comments said something to this effect. Which brings me back to my original question.... Against a player where:

1) We know he's good enough to know what our flop c/r means, and who will usually check behind the turn if checked to unless ahead.

but

2) We don't have a more specific read about his turn bluff raise frequency that would help us make a good decision should he raise the turn

How do you play from the turn onward?

I am inclined to think that bet/cd is best if raised on the turn.

If he smoothcalls the turn, I think an argument can be made for all of b/c, b/f, c/c, and c/f on the river.

Thoughts on this?

[/ QUOTE ]

First of all, I want to point out that if were against a good opponent, the main reason check/raising is better than calling the flop is becuz he will know what our flop call means, but it will be impossible for him to know exactly what our check/raise means since in theory we could be bluffing at some given frequency. That is why check/raising is better than calling vs a competent logician/hand reader.

It may be a problem that check/raising the flop will sometimes set us up for getting pwned on the turn, but against a good player were going to get pwned no matter what line we take here. Check/calling down is not gonna be a panacea vs a good player.

So even if we dont have a specific read and we dont know exactly how to handle a turn raise, were still better off facing this problem vs a good hand reader.

If I had check/raised the flop and got raised on the turn in this spot, I would probably call the turn raise hoping my opponent is freeshdowning me with a worse hand sometimes and then check/fold the river. I dont know if this is the best strategy as this is a horrible spot where all lines are questionable.

If my opponent smooth calls the turn after i c/r the flop, the river is gonna be close between many lines but I dont think I would ever B/C here. I would most likely choose between C/C or B/F. I dont think we can C/F the river either unless we had a super read becuz our kicker is so strong.

[YanMTL]

My question here is what do you do normaly preflop with a Ax hand? Against a button steal, do you 3bet often. If so, does he know that?

if the answer is yes, he probably know you don't have the A since you didn't 3bet preflop and he's putting pressure on you so the call down isn't that bad IMO. If you don't reraise with a Ax hand preflop, it's pretty hard to think you have the best hand here.

[gaming_mouse]

ILP,

Thanks for that last post. Very insightful.