400nl - Re-raised pot with 54s - Page 3

luegofuego · #21 10-10-2007, 02:31 AM

i hate that idea. just bet and shove turn

Big_Jim · #22 10-10-2007, 02:32 AM

Or go all in

Big_Jim · #23 10-10-2007, 02:36 AM

[ QUOTE ]
i hate that idea. just bet and shove turn

[/ QUOTE ]
Always? I think it's a nice way to sometimes get some extra bluff chips in the pot, and we get the last bet in.

What particularly don't you like about it?

If we want to take the more normal approach, I think 110-130ish looks good, cuz it leaves us with some FE on the turn

ogdundar · #24 10-10-2007, 02:37 AM

To those who said check behind: If you are advocating checking behind here, your first thought should be NOT 3-betting preflop. It's not like we 3-bet for value you know.

markuisis · #25 10-10-2007, 03:18 AM

Post deleted by markuisis

ogdundar · #26 10-10-2007, 03:21 AM

My point is a 39/12/2 fish does not fold much preflop so you are going to see postflop action. And with 100BB stacks you need to win this a fair amount postflop by applying pressure, not by flopping big. 3-bet preflop is essentially a "massage the pot"-bet with the calling station in there, and thats not a good play with 100BBs.

So... checking the flop means we are not able to make him fold enough of his range to make a 3-bet preflop profitable.

markuisis · #27 10-10-2007, 03:30 AM

i agree with 3 betting most flops to make pf play profitable, just saying u cant say that just because he made that play pf, he has to bet flop. I think u should only bet if u think u can fold out tens and jacks either on flop or turn, otherwise ur pricing urself in to call a shove when ur certainly gonna be drawing.

Nick Royale · #28 10-10-2007, 06:08 AM

[ QUOTE ]
My point is a 39/12/2 fish does not fold much preflop so you are going to see postflop action. And with 100BB stacks you need to win this a fair amount postflop by applying pressure, not by flopping big. 3-bet preflop is essentially a "massage the pot"-bet with the calling station in there, and thats not a good play with 100BBs.

So... checking the flop means we are not able to make him fold enough of his range to make a 3-bet preflop profitable.

[/ QUOTE ]
I don't think checking the flop goes against raising preflop, as I think I have good fe preflop. Villain is a bad reg and cold calling too much, but he's not terrible and he's not calling my 3-bet with a big part of his range. Sure, probably more often than he should, but still not a big part of his cold calling range.

Besides an argument can be made for checking the flop because no better hands will call and no worse will fold (this is basically true). I agree betting the flop is better though for reasons already stated (setting up a turn shove, protection, avoid a tricky spot on the turn).

Benefits of checking is also that all my outs are hidden so I'm likely having good implied odds. When I hit his 66+ will always still be an overpair.