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#71
08-07-2007, 09:25 PM
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Re: Oh Canada! Let\'s get rid of the income tax.
[ QUOTE ]
And I've been hopelessly confused ever since. [/ QUOTE ] After reading this whole thread, I don't understand how you could be so confused from such an easy example. Is it, just maybe, because you have decided that it makes perfect sense, and now can't admit that you are wrong. And also, to say that there are no people, "living in poverty" in Canada is pretty ridiculous. I guess all of those people lining up for food on Hastings are just out socializing. And those people sleeping under roof's? Getting some fresh air? 
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#72
08-07-2007, 10:28 PM
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Re: Oh Canada! Let\'s get rid of the income tax.
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] [ QUOTE ] [ QUOTE ] No it's common sense. Taxes, in and of themselves, never help anyone. Taxes is just the simple act of the government stealing money from me. [/ QUOTE ] You've gone off the deep-end here. This is totally wrong. Taxes help and hurt people, but it's impossible for money to come into and leave a governemnt (without all of it being embezzeled) and no one to be helped. Argue it's immoral or theft sure, but saying no one is helped by taxes is silly. Cody [/ QUOTE ] This is absolutely true in the short term. However the argument can be made that giving people or companies government money trains them to become good at getting government money rather than perfecting their skills. Take the example of agribusiness. They have pretty much stopped investing in research and technology to get better yields and improve profits that way, rather they have become political experts playing the game to get more and more tax money. Imagine if the government had mandated that every household be bought a playstation (at full $300 price or whatever) back when they first came out. Sony would have had no incentive to improve, lower prices or bring out the PS 2 or 3. They'd have kept rehasing the playstation perhaps spending a little money on token improvements. That's how it works for agribusiness that's how it works for the most part for those on welfare. Why do you think education hasn't changed nearly at all in over 100 years? [/ QUOTE ] Tom, I appriciate it but I understand economics and dependence. Let me ask you then, Can taxes be helpful to a single person or group of people? Ignore the amount of the tax for this question. Cody [/ QUOTE ] Absolutely. For starters they're incredibly helpful to Dick Cheney, Just look at the Haliburton stock price graph.
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#73
08-07-2007, 10:47 PM
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Re: Oh Canada! Let\'s get rid of the income tax.
[ QUOTE ]
Absolutely. For starters they're incredibly helpful to Dick Cheney, Just look at the Haliburton stock price graph. [/ QUOTE ]  It's the gift that keeps on giving!
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#74
08-08-2007, 05:54 AM
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Re: Oh Canada! Let\'s get rid of the income tax.
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] [ QUOTE ] [ QUOTE ] [ QUOTE ] No it's common sense. Taxes, in and of themselves, never help anyone. Taxes is just the simple act of the government stealing money from me. [/ QUOTE ] You've gone off the deep-end here. This is totally wrong. Taxes help and hurt people, but it's impossible for money to come into and leave a governemnt (without all of it being embezzeled) and no one to be helped. Argue it's immoral or theft sure, but saying no one is helped by taxes is silly. Cody [/ QUOTE ] This is absolutely true in the short term. However the argument can be made that giving people or companies government money trains them to become good at getting government money rather than perfecting their skills. Take the example of agribusiness. They have pretty much stopped investing in research and technology to get better yields and improve profits that way, rather they have become political experts playing the game to get more and more tax money. Imagine if the government had mandated that every household be bought a playstation (at full $300 price or whatever) back when they first came out. Sony would have had no incentive to improve, lower prices or bring out the PS 2 or 3. They'd have kept rehasing the playstation perhaps spending a little money on token improvements. That's how it works for agribusiness that's how it works for the most part for those on welfare. Why do you think education hasn't changed nearly at all in over 100 years? [/ QUOTE ] Tom, I appriciate it but I understand economics and dependence. Let me ask you then, Can taxes be helpful to a single person or group of people? Ignore the amount of the tax for this question. Cody [/ QUOTE ] Absolutely. For starters they're incredibly helpful to Dick Cheney, Just look at the Haliburton stock price graph. [/ QUOTE ] So...we agree? Holy crap. Thanks for the answer. Cody
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#75
08-08-2007, 06:47 AM
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Re: Oh Canada! Let\'s get rid of the income tax.
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] [ QUOTE ] [ QUOTE ] [ QUOTE ] [ QUOTE ] No it's common sense. Taxes, in and of themselves, never help anyone. Taxes is just the simple act of the government stealing money from me. [/ QUOTE ] You've gone off the deep-end here. This is totally wrong. Taxes help and hurt people, but it's impossible for money to come into and leave a governemnt (without all of it being embezzeled) and no one to be helped. Argue it's immoral or theft sure, but saying no one is helped by taxes is silly. Cody [/ QUOTE ] This is absolutely true in the short term. However the argument can be made that giving people or companies government money trains them to become good at getting government money rather than perfecting their skills. Take the example of agribusiness. They have pretty much stopped investing in research and technology to get better yields and improve profits that way, rather they have become political experts playing the game to get more and more tax money. Imagine if the government had mandated that every household be bought a playstation (at full $300 price or whatever) back when they first came out. Sony would have had no incentive to improve, lower prices or bring out the PS 2 or 3. They'd have kept rehasing the playstation perhaps spending a little money on token improvements. That's how it works for agribusiness that's how it works for the most part for those on welfare. Why do you think education hasn't changed nearly at all in over 100 years? [/ QUOTE ] Tom, I appriciate it but I understand economics and dependence. Let me ask you then, Can taxes be helpful to a single person or group of people? Ignore the amount of the tax for this question. Cody [/ QUOTE ] Absolutely. For starters they're incredibly helpful to Dick Cheney, Just look at the Haliburton stock price graph. [/ QUOTE ] So...we agree? Holy crap. Thanks for the answer. Cody [/ QUOTE ] No problem. I'm sure there's tons of stuff that we agree on. But you didn't need me in order to show GCYW's posts were wrong on here. Was that all you were after or was there another point? (that is a genuine question and isn't intended to be snide.)
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#76
08-08-2007, 08:35 AM
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Re: Oh Canada! Let\'s get rid of the income tax.
[ QUOTE ]
No problem. I'm sure there's tons of stuff that we agree on. But you didn't need me in order to show GCYW's posts were wrong on here. Was that all you were after or was there another point? (that is a genuine question and isn't intended to be snide.) [/ QUOTE ] Tom, Yeah there probably is. The reason I wanted another take on GCYW's words were because I tend to take everything with a grain of salt on here (when someone says "all" or "never" they really mean 99%) but when GCYW made a follow up post explaining that taxes can't help anyone, I wanted clarification from another person. All the time we hear things like that (not just from ACists, statists as well) things like "without government there won't be corporations/big companies" and other nonsense so it's good to be sure of what the person, who's opinions you're taking the time to read, really thinks. Cody
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#77
08-08-2007, 09:59 AM
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Re: Oh Canada! Let\'s get rid of the income tax.
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] No problem. I'm sure there's tons of stuff that we agree on. But you didn't need me in order to show GCYW's posts were wrong on here. Was that all you were after or was there another point? (that is a genuine question and isn't intended to be snide.) [/ QUOTE ] Tom, Yeah there probably is. The reason I wanted another take on GCYW's words were because I tend to take everything with a grain of salt on here (when someone says "all" or "never" they really mean 99%) but when GCYW made a follow up post explaining that taxes can't help anyone, I wanted clarification from another person. All the time we hear things like that (not just from ACists, statists as well) things like "without government there won't be corporations/big companies" and other nonsense so it's good to be sure of what the person, who's opinions you're taking the time to read, really thinks. Cody [/ QUOTE ] Well noone knows for certain what a society without a government will look exactly like. I think most of the nevers and always' are 70/30 shorthand/hyperbole. It's better than saying under AC it is extremely likely that there will be far fewer big companies and where they exist they will have to show much better management to prove to potential investors that it is worth the increased liability risk. If someone is engaging on the "lol capitalists you must love Enron then" level simple is probably the way to go. Obviously for someone who reads into it, thinks and has an open mind in depth is probably the better answer.
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#78
08-08-2007, 02:13 PM
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Re: Oh Canada! Let\'s get rid of the income tax.
[ QUOTE ]
But you didn't need me in order to show GCYW's posts were wrong on here. [/ QUOTE ] I was curious about this. I mean, he seemed to be out of line with the ACers whose posts - even if I disagree with them sometimes - generally come accross as well reasoned, but I was also thinking there was some chance his POV might be representative of the AC philosophy on this issue.
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