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#1
11-15-2007, 07:58 PM
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NL50: TP2K, interesting one pair hand in unraised pot.
I really think this was an interesting spot and I'd really like some opinions on it. I'll describe my thinking process a little later in case anyone is interested, but I'd really like to hear YOUR thinking in such a spot. So, fire away, flame me for my play if you want and tell me how you would play such a hand.
Villain is 38/14/0.7 over only 135 hands. He started out as a small stack and winded up having close to a full stack when this hand came up. He likes to play tricky, maybe a little FPS there. Anyway, I wouldn't call him a good player. I'm running at this table at (for me) incredible tight 10/8. I'm already curious to hear your comments, I know you're going to hate my PF play but I have my reasons... [img]/images/graemlins/smirk.gif[/img] (I put my turn action in white below BTW.) Full Tilt Poker, $0.25/$0.50 NL Hold'em Cash Game, 7 Players LeggoPoker Hand History Converter Hero (CO): $52.05 BTN: $12.80 SB: $65.95 BB: $45.15 UTG: $65.05 UTG+1: $40.95 MP: $34.50 Pre-Flop: K[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] Q[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] dealt to Hero (CO) UTG calls $0.50, UTG+1 calls $0.50, MP calls $0.50, Hero calls $0.50, BTN calls $0.50, SB calls $0.25, BB checks Flop: ($3.50) 2[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 8[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] K[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (7 Players) SB checks, BB checks, UTG checks, <font color="red">UTG+1 bets $3.50</font>, MP folds, Hero calls $3.50, 4 folds Turn: ($10.50) 3[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (2 Players) <font color="red">UTG+1 bets $10.50</font>, <font color="red">Hero <font color="white">raises to $42 <font color="white"> 
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#2
11-15-2007, 08:16 PM
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Re: NL50: TP2K, interesting one pair hand in unraised pot.
fwiw I don't think pf is especially terrible but I raise it.
I also raise the flop.
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#3
11-16-2007, 05:34 AM
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Re: NL50: TP2K, interesting one pair hand in unraised pot.
I would raise flop too. One reason is that I am not usually comfortable letting the hand develop passive (waiting game) with only top pair, especially when I don't have the best kicker.
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#4
11-16-2007, 05:49 AM
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Re: NL50: TP2K, interesting one pair hand in unraised pot.
Raise preflop. Sorry but wow, what a terrible turn raise lol.
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#5
11-16-2007, 05:49 AM
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Re: NL50: TP2K, interesting one pair hand in unraised pot.
Raise PF, but okay.
As played, raising the flop sucks balls with four people left to act. I see no reason to raise the turn unless you think he calls with like KJ. He's potted it twice, once into six players...does he really do this with a worse hand than TPQK?
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#6
11-16-2007, 06:11 AM
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Re: NL50: TP2K, interesting one pair hand in unraised pot.
I raise pre flop here most of the time. Reason being is the limp creates tricky spots in multiway pots. playing 40 percent of his hands he could pretty much have anything. Plus the pre flop raise is punishing him for playing that many hands. The limp isn't terrible though and could be just as good as a raise. But you have to play it differently and be ready to let it go a lot easier. As played, I probably throw in a reraise on the flop of about 9. Yeah, there are 4 left to act, but you're gonna find out quickly whether you're beat or not.
Another side note is the way this is played you are allowing him to take control of the pot. By raising preflop/flop you put yourself in a position where you have control. You want to put yourself in positions where the decisions are easy for you and hard on your opponents.
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#7
11-16-2007, 06:28 AM
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Re: NL50: TP2K, interesting one pair hand in unraised pot.
another thought on this hand with the pre flop limp I believe you're creating a spr that you want to flop a bigger hand than just top pair 2nd best kicker. This hand would have played out much more smoother imo with the pre flop raise, which could have been big given all the limping which would have created a much better spr for the situation. I really need to reread that book as the concept is still pretty new to me.
Oh and I didn't look at the action in white. After thinking the hand through for sometime I think i'm folding. However, I can see myself in the same position reraising and going broke just as well.
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#8
11-16-2007, 07:36 AM
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Re: NL50: TP2K, interesting one pair hand in unraised pot.
[ QUOTE ]
Raise preflop. Sorry but wow, what a terrible turn raise lol. [/ QUOTE ] Allright, that's what I excpected to hear and it was also why I said that I'd like to hear your thinking process. Could you elaborate yours a little Allthecheese? Let me add one thing: I was already with my mouse over the fold button but then used my time bank and started to really think through the whole hand again. [ QUOTE ] another thought on this hand with the pre flop limp I believe you're creating a spr that you want to flop a bigger hand than just top pair 2nd best kicker. [/ QUOTE ] I agree completely on this and when I only limped with this hand, I knew that I was playing this hand for "fit or fold" pretty much. I did not plan to continue here with TP only but they way this hand developed my opinion changed.
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#9
11-16-2007, 12:09 PM
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Re: NL50: TP2K, interesting one pair hand in unraised pot.
So I am a little disappointed that this hand did not get more love but, oh well, that's the way it is.
I think it was very interesting because IMO, it was a great expamle for how to play if you really think through the hand before making key decisions. As meniontend already, I already wanted to fold on the turn here before I thought about it again. Looking at his PF play, his post flop line and his playing tendencies so far, I figured that I had to be in front here and that, additionally, villain would not be able to get away from his (worse) hand. I'll just post results here in case anyone is interested: Full Tilt Poker, $0.25/$0.50 NL Hold'em Cash Game, 7 Players LeggoPoker Hand History Converter Hero (CO): $52.05 BTN: $12.80 SB: $65.95 BB: $45.15 UTG: $65.05 UTG+1: $40.95 MP: $34.50 Pre-Flop: K[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] Q[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] dealt to Hero (CO) UTG calls $0.50, UTG+1 calls $0.50, MP calls $0.50, Hero calls $0.50, BTN calls $0.50, SB calls $0.25, BB checks Flop: ($3.50) 2[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 8[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] K[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (7 Players) SB checks, BB checks, UTG checks, <font color="red">UTG+1 bets $3.50</font>, MP folds, Hero calls $3.50, 4 folds Turn: ($10.50) 3[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (2 Players) <font color="red">UTG+1 bets $10.50</font>, <font color="red">Hero raises to $42</font>, UTG+1 calls $26.45 and is All-In River: ($84.40) 7[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (2 Players - 1 is All-In) Results: $84.40 Pot ($3 Rake) Hero showed K[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] Q[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (a pair of Kings) and WON $81.40 (+$40.45 NET) UTG+1 showed K[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 9[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (a pair of Kings) and LOST (-$40.95 NET)
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#10
11-16-2007, 12:17 PM
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Re: NL50: TP2K, interesting one pair hand in unraised pot.
Why can't villain be on something like 22/88 and charging heart draws as much as he can? I agree that AK is very unlikely here, but I'm curious as to what made you decide he wasn't playing a set. (i.e. you think he'd bet or c/r either turn or flop?)
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