FTP Answers: Special Fraud Edition

[Wongboy]

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Suggestions:

1) Send clear information about what the player has done. Don't tell them with the first email that you send that the matter is closed without recourse. This makes you look really [censored] stupid when the site later backs down after making a mistake.

2) Give the player opportunity to appeal the initial decision, regardless of how clear cut it might be. The appeal should be reviewed by someone who was not involved in the original review in any way to ensure an unbiased re-evaluation. I am sure that you don't make these decisions without a 2nd opinion initially, but yet still mistakes happen. Another review also protects FTP against internal fraud from employees that might just want to steal a players money... or something like that anyway.

3) Even after a player has had their appeal turned down, tell them that they have exhausted the channels with FTP but give them a way to take their complaint further. i.e. The gaming commission.

John

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I second these and would add that the player should have the ability to challenge evidence and conclusions involved in the decision. In addition, the bar should be set pretty high to ensure that an innocent person is not wrongfully convicted. In alot of cases, it seems that the decision is based on circumstantial evidence, which might be sufficient if persuasive enough, but the evidence needs to be very persuasive for this to be the case. After all, you are talking about seizures involving substantial sums of money in many cases.

The sites have a motivation to err on the side of seizure in order to protect their funds. This is only balanced by the PR risk if a site over reaches. However, given that sites are either unwilling or unable to provide detailed evidence in a public forum, this PR risk seems to be pretty low. Since we can not rely on a gaming commission to regulate the sites behavior, I think it is imperative for sites to go above and beyond in providing assurances that money will only be seized if a case is proven beyond a reasonable doubt.

[Dennisa]

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I'm not trying to start a tinfoil-hatted conspiracy theory, I'm legitimately curious if the poker site ends up ultimately benefiting from these scenarios, although if they do it's unintentional I'm sure.



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I use to own an internet ecommerce site. As a credit card merchant, you are normally paid withing 72 hours after you have an approved credit card and close the batch. Within 2 months, you may receive a chargeback request for the merchant processor. In my case, my customer was not satisfied with their goods, or they claim they never received it, or someone stole their credit card. The credit card companies would then ask for my side of the story, I could then send them documentation about the case. On a stolen card, eventually the merchant processor would electronically reverse the original transaction and I the merchant was out the money. This should be the case for Full Tilt, which is why they keep all funds that are from locked accounts. I doubt they are able to collect more than 25% of the fraud that they are hit for. sorry for the long answer.

Dennisa

[smak]

The only thing I am still curious about, since i pretty much am convinced by the FTP people, is what exact follow up is done in these situations.

Ok, your fraud dept decided this. They then email the person involved about it, and the confiscation of the money takes place.

Is that the end of it? Is an email sufficient enough to tell a person, no matter how guilty, that you've confiscated $14k of their money.

No legal type letter is going out to these people. There are obviously zillions of cases where it's obvious that somebody is 100% guilty of what they're accused of, but not many cases where the other party is judge, jury and executioner.

[frommagio]

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Thanks Doug!
Thanks Full Tilt!!

After reading the never ending river of crap flowing from Ericjones and BurnleyDik, I pledged a weekend of support for Full Tilt by playing there exclusively.

Well, lucky me. My month plus cold streak ended with a 1.4k award in a MTT!

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Well that was not needed and uncalled for. No one made you read it, but I suppose it shows your level of intelligence.

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Hey idiot non savant, I think he's challenging your views.

[TimWillTell]

To me this whole situation seems to be a typical case of:"The Postman Always Rings Twice."

It would even explain why the 8k wasn't dumped on the first account and why ericjones risked 600 of his own money with the second account.
Hell, it would even explain the delay that FullTilt used to bust ericjones!
And last, it would also explain why ericjones, although he planned a scam, became so furious when busted.

Sleep tight!

[froggy527]

Four pages to this thread and not one post from Eric Jones!

I think you can stick a fork in him!!!

[BurnleyMik]

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Thanks Doug!
Thanks Full Tilt!!

After reading the never ending river of crap flowing from Ericjones and BurnleyDik, I pledged a weekend of support for Full Tilt by playing there exclusively.

Well, lucky me. My month plus cold streak ended with a 1.4k award in a MTT!

[/ QUOTE ]

Well that was not needed and uncalled for. No one made you read it, but I suppose it shows your level of intelligence.

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Hey idiot non savant, I think he's challenging your views.

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ROTFL...not with you...at you.

[frommagio]

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Thanks Doug!
Thanks Full Tilt!!

After reading the never ending river of crap flowing from Ericjones and BurnleyDik, I pledged a weekend of support for Full Tilt by playing there exclusively.

Well, lucky me. My month plus cold streak ended with a 1.4k award in a MTT!

[/ QUOTE ]

Well that was not needed and uncalled for. No one made you read it, but I suppose it shows your level of intelligence.

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Hey idiot non savant, I think he's challenging your views.

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ROTFL...not with you...at you.

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Hey ButterMilk, come back and post your eric responses now.

[BurnleyMik]

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Hey ButterMilk, come back and post your eric responses now.

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ok if you say so. Its over now whatever and calling names etc. doesn't make any sense. If you wish to carry on..then by all means keep yourself amused, but as for me...I am bored of it.

[BurnleyMik]

Lets just try and keep this thread to what its about, FTP's new improvements. No one wants to see silly comments and name calling, these are adult discussions...hope this helps.