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  #1  
Old 11-21-2007, 02:19 AM
RustyBrooks RustyBrooks is offline
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Default (stud8) how best to handle 4th st?

What is the best move to try to clear the field a little? I'd prefer that the low draws fold. Bet out as first to act, representing that the A hit me or that I have 4 low cards? Or try to check-raise hoping that the K or the late low will bet?

How much do I lose by trying to check-raise and having it check through?

7 Card Stud High-Low ($0.50/$1.00), Ante $0.05, Bring-In $0.25 (converter)

3rd Street - (0.80 SB)

Seat 1: xx xx Q[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]___folds
Seat 2: xx xx 4[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]___folds
Seat 3: xx xx 6[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]___folds
Seat 4: xx xx K[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]___raises
Hero: 2[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 3[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 3[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]___calls
Seat 6: xx xx 2[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]___brings-in___calls
Seat 7: xx xx 8[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]___folds
Seat 8: xx xx 8[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]___calls___calls

4th Street - (4.80 SB)

Seat 4: xx xx K[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 6[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]
Hero: 2[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 3[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 3[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] A[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] ___???
Seat 6: xx xx 2[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 5[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]
Seat 8: xx xx 8[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 7[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]
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  #2  
Old 11-21-2007, 02:50 AM
PokrLikeItsProse PokrLikeItsProse is offline
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Default Re: (stud8) how best to handle 4th st?

[ QUOTE ]
I'd prefer that the low draws fold.

[/ QUOTE ]

How about having a more realistic goal? No one is folding a low draw on fourth.

P.S. Fold third.
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  #3  
Old 11-21-2007, 03:01 AM
xxeximusxx xxeximusxx is offline
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Default Re: (stud8) how best to handle 4th st?

well third is probably a fold for a full bet, however if the king didn't raise i'd limp along.

fourth you caught you absolute gin card, other than a trey. Id probably just lead out, your calling one bet anyways. I don't expect to see any raising unless the king is rolled up.
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  #4  
Old 11-21-2007, 03:01 AM
Alchemist Alchemist is offline
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Default Re: (stud8) how best to handle 4th st?

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
I'd prefer that the low draws fold.

[/ QUOTE ]

How about having a more realistic goal? No one is folding a low draw on fourth.

P.S. Fold third.

[/ QUOTE ]

Not even Seat 8 facing 25, 3A and an overpair?
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  #5  
Old 11-21-2007, 03:12 AM
Praxising Praxising is offline
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Default Re: (stud8) how best to handle 4th st?

[ QUOTE ]
Not even Seat 8 facing 25, 3A and an overpair?

[/ QUOTE ]
I don't think so, not at this limit. Besides, it's 4th and you know how fast a low hand can turn into over 8 junk. He's gonna wait and see if they start to get big cards.
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  #6  
Old 11-21-2007, 01:27 PM
Alchemist Alchemist is offline
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Default Re: (stud8) how best to handle 4th st?

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Not even Seat 8 facing 25, 3A and an overpair?

[/ QUOTE ]
I don't think so, not at this limit. Besides, it's 4th and you know how fast a low hand can turn into over 8 junk. He's gonna wait and see if they start to get big cards.

[/ QUOTE ]

I'm not sure what you're trying to say here. The 87 should be folding to a bet on 4th, unless he's got a good high draw like 8765 or trips/two pair. Drawing to a disconnected 87 low while looking at 25 and 3A is just asking to go broke. But since we only have a 3-card low ourselves, we want him to fold.
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  #7  
Old 11-21-2007, 01:44 PM
Alchemist Alchemist is offline
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Default Re: (stud8) how best to handle 4th st?

I told Rusty to post this hand because we disagreed on 4th Street. I advocated betting out on 4th but he thought a C/R was better because it would be more likely to clear the field.

The problem I see in this spot, is who's going to bet after we catch an Ace? The best person to have bet to thin the field is the guy with Kings on our right. He'll be hard-pressed to bet in the face of 3 guys showing possible 4-card lows and us after we just caught an Ace. If he does bet and we C/R, he's probably got Kings up, and I don't think we want to be HU with him holding a 3-card low and baby pair. We'll have to catch mighty good on 5th for us to even continue, and it'll cost us an additional small bet to get to this spot.

Betting 4th seems like the natural thing. Everyone will be scared of it and we want to get people to fold. I think if we check, it's way too likely it'll check around and I don't like the idea of everyone else (especially the low hands, one who was the BI) to get a free look at 5th. I prefer taking control of the action and if the cards come down favorably on 5th, we might be able to take the pot then.
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  #8  
Old 11-21-2007, 03:54 PM
Hamlet Hamlet is offline
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Default Re: (stud8) how best to handle 4th st?

I think that if you check, the 2,5 is usually going to bet, not the King. Even if it worked out and it checked to the King that bet, the low-draws are not likely to fold.

You're behind both ways, so I don't think it checking through "costs you anything." I think a free card would be a fine outcome.

That said, I think you are unlikely to get a free card, and since you have enough to call, I would just bet out.

I would hate to be the King in this spot. I would be very tempted to fold a pair of Kings in this spot. There is no way I'm betting them if it checks to me.
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  #9  
Old 11-21-2007, 04:02 PM
RustyBrooks RustyBrooks is offline
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Default Re: (stud8) how best to handle 4th st?

It did in fact check through, bless their tender souls.
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  #10  
Old 11-21-2007, 04:27 PM
Alchemist Alchemist is offline
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Default Re: (stud8) how best to handle 4th st?

[ QUOTE ]
I think that if you check, the 2,5 is usually going to bet, not the King. Even if it worked out and it checked to the King that bet, the low-draws are not likely to fold.

You're behind both ways, so I don't think it checking through "costs you anything." I think a free card would be a fine outcome.

That said, I think you are unlikely to get a free card, and since you have enough to call, I would just bet out.

I would hate to be the King in this spot. I would be very tempted to fold a pair of Kings in this spot. There is no way I'm betting them if it checks to me.

[/ QUOTE ]

I agree that the BI is the most likely of our Villains to bet 4th if we check. And if they all call, which is what people are predicting, then check-raising as last to act seems like a really bad idea.

I think 3rd is a fold. But we're in the pot now so let's take advantage of catching a great card. If I'm one of the Villains, I put Hero squarely on a good 4-card low or Aces. The BI's range is a bit wider because it's only half of a small bet to call 3rd, but he probably doesn't have total crap. He can't like his hand too much if the 5 paired him with a known overpair already involved.
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