Don't raise AK preflop, ever acceptable?

[Taso]

I was wondering if it makes sense to not raise with AK preflop in an extremly loose game. The kind of game where a continuation bet on the flop will almost never take it down. Essentially, if you miss, you're probably going to lose the pot.

Opinions? Is this just results based thinking?

[springsteen87]

I would say it's results based thinking. If it's extremely loose IMO just raise more than you usually would preflop. You want to be paid for your premium hands, and if the game is as loose as you say it is you will. Just make them pay more than they should to see cards

[Gonso]

Most likely my adjustment would be to raise a greater amount here. If you're getting a lot of calls you're not getting much respect, try value betting pre 6 or 7 bb if you need to. You still want to cut the field down somewhat and punish them for their bad play as bet you can.

Also, you can't give up the pot every time you miss. If they're calling stations, then adjust accordingly but AK is still going to be ahead more often than not on most flops. If they're going to call your c-bets regardless, than even an unimproved AK is going to be ahead of their range on a lot of boards.

In this type of game, just tighten up your hands a bit, and push your hands a little harder. Your ranges will be ahead of theirs most of the time... you're bluffs lose a lot of value but you can regain that through more aggressive value betting.

[Vetgirig]

By raising a greater amount with AK - one also tell the other players one has AK. They can thus play against one perfectly.

[Matt Williams]

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By raising a greater amount with AK - one also tell the other players one has AK. They can thus play against one perfectly.

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Exactly. There are plenty of times when I don't raise w/ AK. If I'm on the button and 3-6 have limped in, there's nothing wrong w/ seeing the flop cheaply. In limit though, I raise 100% of the time.

[Explicit65]

definitely result based thinking. you raise with AK.

[Bantam222]

you're saying that when you raise AK you get too many callers and they will call your cbet with any part of the flop. So you don't have to cbet if its a multiway pot, but you still want to raise it so when you do hit a flop, the pot will be bigger and you can make more money.

You have the best hand preflop, you want to get as much money in preflop as you can. simple.

[Woolygimp]

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By raising a greater amount with AK - one also tell the other players one has AK. They can thus play against one perfectly.

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Exactly. There are plenty of times when I don't raise w/ AK. If I'm on the button and 3-6 have limped in, there's nothing wrong w/ seeing the flop cheaply. In limit though, I raise 100% of the time.

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[Mark1808]

[ QUOTE ]
I was wondering if it makes sense to not raise with AK preflop in an extremly loose game. The kind of game where a continuation bet on the flop will almost never take it down. Essentially, if you miss, you're probably going to lose the pot.

Opinions? Is this just results based thinking?

[/ QUOTE ]

If you are in a loose game that generally sees a raised pot you may consider making a large 3 bet just as you would with AA or KK either in position, from the blinds or an early position limp reraise. This mixes up your play and even in a loose game should ususally get you heads up on the flop where your continuation bet will get more respect.

[Gonso]

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By raising a greater amount with AK - one also tell the other players one has AK. They can thus play against one perfectly.

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No, they can't, because as I pointed out you're raising generally larger amounts against this crowd in general. It's a good way to take advantage of these players, and it's aimed to get you more value on your good hands.

There's almost always going to be more value in raising AK preflop than just calling with it. These players are playing too many hands too loosely, exploit them for it. It's easy to lose a lot of money with TPTK in an unraised pot with AK, especially if there are three other players in the pot.

You can obviously mix it up now and again, but as this situation is described there's really no need to try to get too fancy. Your complex deception schemes are going to be worthless against loose-weak type players who are generally pretty bad players. Keep in mind that it's harder to make a monster hidden hand you can get paid with when you have AK (as opposed to a hand like 44 flopping a set, or making a odd straight with 76, which are less obvious).

Now, defining your range here isn't always the end of the world anyway. You can fold a few pairs with a decent 3-bet, and tons of hands whose live cards are still not that far behind you. Taking down the pot preflop is just fine with AK, and frankly there are tons of occasions where you can play it for stacks preflop as well.