Badugi resources online?

[Jackal69]

damn stars need to get badugi...

[2461Badugi]

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I feel the game is similar to O/8

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Damn. I was hoping no one else had figured that out.

I disagree to an extent about the hands, though. Position in Badugi is huuuuge, much larger even than 2-7 TD. I would much rather have a mediocre three-card hand and position than A2xx OOP. I don't consider either playable from EP if the people behind me have a clue.

Here's the key to first-round play: isolate from the CO or button. If you can do this reliably it almost doesn't matter what your hand is. In order to counteract this, EP players have to play tight and catch, or become total calling stations with three-card hands, either of which is easily exploitable.

I think if we had PT for Badugi you'd see almost everybody losing money UTG. There's a huge differential between what you can play early and what you can play late.

[DeathDonkey]

Good points 2461badugi. I will just add that I think your implied odds with a hand like A2xy can be quite good and if you catch well right away you can play profitable OOP as long as you get out quickly when you catch poorly. The reason is of course that once you are ahead you stay ahead a high percentage of the time and your poor playing opponents never fold when they see you still drawing one too.

If you disagree about my pull and push hands idea can you explain a bit (maybe with comparison examples) what you feel is O/8-ish about badugi?

-DeathDonkey

[Biggle10]

Slightly off topic, how come there are rarely low limit 'other games' played live even though the pool of players is larger? I'd love to play some badugi live, but the smallest game I've ever heard is 10/20.

[*TT*]

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Good points 2461badugi. I will just add that I think your implied odds with a hand like A2xy can be quite good and if you catch well right away you can play profitable OOP as long as you get out quickly when you catch poorly. The reason is of course that once you are ahead you stay ahead a high percentage of the time and your poor playing opponents never fold when they see you still drawing one too.

If you disagree about my pull and push hands idea can you explain a bit (maybe with comparison examples) what you feel is O/8-ish about badugi?

-DeathDonkey

[/ QUOTE ]DD's push/pull concept + 2461badugi's positional advantage = how I play.

[palman]

While I agree position is valuable, position also changes in badugi much like it does in a stud game. In certain games, say you limp in EP, someone raises from MP, and you get 4 or 5 way action with the blinds coming in.... all the sudden you are in the best position to profit if you make your hand. This is especially true if the preflop raiser never checks behind with a made badugi on a big street, and always bets all 123, 124 type hands, which quite alot of badugi players fall into the trap.

You can play much weaker draws when the guy driving the action is directly to your left in multiway pots because you'll have all the information you'll ever need. It's either 2 bets to you and you dump, or you're closing out the action most always. Conversely, in most large multiway pots, you can hardly profitably play a hand if you've got direct position on the pat/driving the action player. If you're drawing you're going to be putting in 2 or more bets to draw way too often, and if you make a hand you'll end up winning alot of smaller pots. Most the big pots are won when you make a hand in a multi-way pot OOP.

In Heads-up pots where players tend to give up with 1 draw to come if they think they have an inferior draw, I tend to play my strong 3 card draws much differently than most of my opponnents. I always try to show weakness at some point in the hand, to encourage a weaker 3 card hand to think they might be good.

Start off a heads up match raising before the first draw with an A23, or catching something similar after a 2 card draw and checking it and you really open yourself up to be able to play many more hands and many more weaker 3 card hands and taking pot after pot.

[DeathDonkey]

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Slightly off topic, how come there are rarely low limit 'other games' played live even though the pool of players is larger? I'd love to play some badugi live, but the smallest game I've ever heard is 10/20.

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Because most low limit players are fish and fish don't know any poker theory so they wouldn't want to play a game besides texas hold'em since they think they know how to play that game.

Also its a cycle, there are no low limit mix games so low limit players don't feel a need to learn how to play mix games, rinse, repeat.

At high limits the fish aren't like "badugi fish" they are just rich guys who want to play a big game and if its a mix game fine, sometimes they know how to play and sometimes they have no clue. I played 400/800 triple draw with a guy who 4 bet the river and proudly showed down Aces full. As you can imagine, this phenomenon is better than if there were "badugi fish" in a similar way to "holdem fish".

-DeathDonkey

[DegenerateRambler]

Just mail them (ideas@pokerstars.com) and request it. I've done the same and I guess the more requests they receive, the more likely they are to consider it. Well, at least in a perfect world...

[2461Badugi]

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In certain games, say you limp in EP, someone raises from MP, and you get 4 or 5 way action with the blinds coming in

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I think anyone is fully justified in ignoring my advice if they're in a game like this. Somehow I never end up in them. Possibly because outLAGging LAGs is much more fun.

[press.gang]

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always bets all 123, 124 type hands, which quite alot of badugi players fall into the trap.


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i'm interested in you expanding on this if it goes beyond what what said in your post. if it has to do w/ slowplaying (missing the small bet after the 1st draw to gain the big bet after the second draw) then nevermind, i get what you are saying and will have to think about the concept some more.

if there is some other purpose to not betting ABC and ABD in the dark after the 1st and 2nd draws then please elaborate.

DD's article at deuces cracked was all i needed to crush every badugi game i've played in. everything else is meta.

also, for what it's worth, i am not quite on board w/ the whole push/pull thing. but people over valuing rough 3 cards is definitely where the money in this game comes from. 3 to an A7 is the most mis-played hand in the game. that's why 3-bet my A2's, to isolate against an over-valued 3 to a 7.

and people at the mid-limits probably don't snow enough which means they can't VB any badugi like they should be able to.