Deep in FTP 13k Guarentee AJ out of BB

[_zzyzx_]

Like 11 people left. SB is a total loose donk and button is fairly tight. Both tables have been playing insanely tight. Shove or call?

Full Tilt Poker
No Limit Holdem Tournament
Blinds: t2000/t4000
(Ante: t500)
5 players
Converter

Stack sizes:
UTG: t58080
CO: t53306
Button: t79214
SB: t104088
Hero: t108366

Pre-flop: (5 players) Hero is BB with A[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] J[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]
2 folds, <font color="#cc0000">Button raises to t12000</font>, SB calls t10000 <font color="aaaaaa">(pot was t20500)</font> Hero?

[_zzyzx_]

4x is his standard raise fwiw

[coatsie]

i call. As 4x is his standard raise, his 3bb raise shows more strength so i would put a tighter range on this tight player like TT+, AQ+. i smell QQ or KK tho.

[Tackleberry]

[ QUOTE ]
[...]Both tables have been playing insanely tight.[...]

[/ QUOTE ]

With this said, the call of SB is remarkable as well in my opinion. He has massive chips, nevertheless is Villain able to cripple him if he loses. So you have a Button-raise which departs from his normal line and a SB who calls 2,5 times his initial blind. I would assume a range for BU of 99-AA, AKs, AQs and for SB of 88 - JJ, AK, AQs. No way to push here for me with a marginal hand against the second big stack! I would just call and prepare to fold if I don´t hit the flop very hard.

[umistboy]

I would just fold and look for a better spot. I'd play if SB not in. Only 4k gone. Fet to Ft and anything can happen.

[Tackleberry]

This as well is a reasonable alternative ...

[WuTank]

You have only 25BB i think you should shove or fold here,and AJ is much 2 weak to shove imho.
I would shove here AK+,KK,AA

[umistboy]

[ QUOTE ]
You have only 25BB i think you should shove or fold here,and AJ is much 2 weak to shove imho.
I would shove here AK+,KK,AA

[/ QUOTE ]

I'd be a bit looser than that. AQs+, TT+ as the button has a wide stealing range even if tight and SB could have anything.

[Uitje]

[ QUOTE ]
SB is a total loose donk and button is fairly tight.

[/ QUOTE ]
Seems like a shove to me.
IF button wouldve had a hand he wouldve bet 4x to get value from this total loose donk, right? This 3BB bet looks more like a "I want to get them blinds cheaply, or be able to continbet without losing 3/4 my stack" then like a "I got a total monster and since 4BB is more likely to chase them away I just do 3BB".

[BarryLyndon]

AJ is a strong enough hand to push here and this is a fairly standard push.

There is now ~27K in the pot, so even if button has 88-1010 and calls (I see him folding 66 or 77, btw), you are getting some nice overlay from SB. If SB is loose and a donk, he may think "OH BOY, BB PUSH, I call with KQ or A10" and that is nice. Button's range that you don't mind getting it in against includes KQ, KJs, some As, 22-1010, maybe K10s too; that range is enough for me to play aggressive. If he's VERY TIGHT, well, that's different, but "fairly tight" usually meets this range. Push.

Barry