Problem adjusting to aggression in SH games and very frustrated

dragon14 · #1 03-13-2007, 08:28 PM

Back before Party closed to Americans I felt pretty comfortable playing either 20-40 or 30-60 6 max. Anytime I could find an opponent with a VPIP in the range of 35-50 I felt I had an edge over the opposition. Often I found two opponents with VPIP's in the 40's and I was on a nice roll.

After a successful stint at NL (+10K in 9K hands) over the past few months I have recently tried my hand at Pokerstars 15-30 and 10-20 games and have being getting killed. On Party's 30-60 game in October if I had A-Jo and raised from the button and the flop came all low cards the action was:
Flop: I bet, he calls
Turn: I bet, he calls
River: Check, check
So it was taking 1.5 BB's to see the river with A high. If I was beat it at least was cheap to find out.

Now even the 5-10 and 10-20 game follow this pattern:
Flop:I bet, he checkraises
Turn:He bets, I...
River:He bets virtually 100% of the time

So now a hand that once cost 1.5 BB to see the river now costs 3 BB's each time. And I'm getting checkraised not just by top pair on the flop but by middle pair, bottom pair, a semi-bluff draw, and an outright bluff.

These are not the games that I studied for months on Stoxpoker.com and these games simply did not exist aside from High Stakes until just recently. The loose passive and maniac have been replaced by the loose aggressive. I'm wondering how to even start approaching these games. Essentially these games are all playing as hyperaggressive heads-up HE and I feel completely lost at much lower limits than I played just last Fall.

It's gotten to the point where I'm a winner in NL (a game I've read a half of a book on) but I'm a loser at LHE (a game I've spent the last several years attempting to master). I've cashed out of Pokerstars and am considering playing live full ring exclusively as every hand online feels like psychological warfare and the action is coming 125 hands or so an hour. This is not the game I learned to could consistently beat just six months ago.

I know theoretically that one is supposed to "mix it up" and "play poker" but I really could use some advice on how to handle the games. I'm thinking that perhaps I'm just in over my head and simply need to look at poker as something fun to do at a casino on the weekend rather than as something that can be a significant source of income.

I'm still in the black for my career but I have taken a 20K hit since December and am down 345BB from my all time high (something I never imagined was possible).

I know that Stox's new book is coming out soon, but I had a lesson with the coauthor last summer and he confirmed my belief that I was playing well enough to win at the Party 20-40 games last summer. I can play well but I'm not going to kid myself that I'm a world class player and can play with anyone, anytime. Any comments or suggestions would be appreciated.

Victor · #2 03-13-2007, 08:39 PM

i think you are full of [censored]. party 20-40 and 30-60 was a complete aggro tiltfest.

those games were tough and had a ton of variance. anyone thats says otherwise was just running hot and didnt play enough hands.

however, im not sure how they compare to ftp and stars nowadays. party may have been much easier so your point could still stand. but, imo, those party games were tougher than any games i played in prior and since.

admiralfluff · #3 03-13-2007, 08:39 PM

Yes, the games are different and tougher. It's no party, but they're still very beateable. I'm guessing you are too tight and passive for today's games. Maybe24/17 asb 35 is about your flavor? Well, unfortunately there aren't any quick fixes or easy changes that can be immediately implemented to turn you into a winning LAG. If you really want to learn how to beat the MH limit games, you should probably start with 5/10ish on PS or FT, and post lots of hands in SSSH.

dragon14 · #4 03-13-2007, 09:10 PM

Close, my stats are 28/18, 37% ASB, and I learned this style from the Stoxpoker.com website. Maybe I should just stick to live poker while I study up on SSSH.

Victor, why would I wish to make up a post about how I've been losing badly recently at poker? Your response is very bizarre.

Victor · #5 03-13-2007, 09:21 PM

you missed the point. i dont doubt you are losing.

i just totally deny that the party 20 and 30 games were as easy as you seem to think. and i doubt the stars/ftp games are that much toughter.

heres what happened. you ran hot over not too many hands on party. now you are doing average or less than average.

poker has variance. you dont always win or win consitently.

gehrig · #6 03-13-2007, 09:22 PM

[ QUOTE ]

poker has variance. you dont always win or win consitently.

[/ QUOTE ]
?

Victor · #7 03-13-2007, 09:23 PM

unless you are gehrig.

ssmallz · #8 03-13-2007, 09:25 PM

28/18 is fine and stats are pretty useless as they don't tell the whole story. Post some hands, focus especially on postflop play.

In the hand you mentioned above, maybe you should consider checking the flop and calling down. I know it sounds weak but the pot is small but this guy is aggro enough to where you want to get to showdown.

dragon14 · #9 03-13-2007, 09:30 PM

When you reply to a complete stranger with the phrase "your full of [censored]" you are seriously lacking in common courtesy and are asking not to be taken seriously. I'm going to add you to my ignore list.

Secondly, I'm not deluded, the bad players were indeed loose passive and that's where my edge was. I do know how to use PAHUD and could see their LP stats with my own eyes. In fact as soon as someone I regarded as loose passive left the table, all the other TAG's would leave immediately as well.

I'm always curious about someone who knows my own poker history better than I do. Variance is not a new concept to me. This is not the beginner's forum.

Scary_Tiger · #10 03-13-2007, 09:34 PM

[ QUOTE ]
When you reply to a complete stranger with the phrase "your full of [censored]" you are seriously lacking in common courtesy and are asking not to be taken seriously. I'm going to add you to my ignore list.

Secondly, I'm not deluded, the bad players were indeed loose passive and that's where my edge was. I do know how to use PAHUD and could see their LP stats with my own eyes. In fact as soon as someone I regarded as loose passive left the table, all the other TAG's would leave immediately as well.

I'm always curious about someone who knows my own poker history better than I do. Variance is not a new concept to me. This is not the beginner's forum.

[/ QUOTE ]

You're just costing yourself money.