"Jesus" advises Yang to stiff dealers?

[suzy89222]

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I will start by saying i am NOT defending pkrporcupine, as she is way out of control on this.

Yes, I realize everyone pays taxes. I was just trying to clarify the people saying dealers make $50/hour or whatever. As for the tips being taxed, i guess every place is different. I know some places that report 100% of tips and I know other places that dealers walk out with the cash. I am assuming, maybe I shouldnt, that a tournament would be reporting 100% of tips simply because there would be some much figuring to see how much each dealer made

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and i am simply saying that there is no reason to clarify. everyone knows they are supposed to pay taxes. just like everyone else. the part about them not paying all of their taxes was beside the point.

[VegasTommy]

(On the flipside for those who say dealers make too much and have an easy job should just become dealers.)

I thought this quote was great. Everyone keeps saying that Dealers make too much money. Then why doesnt everyone deal? If it was that easy of a job, with large amounts of pay, then it should be easy to hire enough qualified Dealers to deal around Las Vegas and the Circuit.

Tommy

[El Diablo]

prkp,

Here's one thing I'm curious about that just plain doesn't add up for me.

dealer pay based on $24/down rate: "$267.28 for the day"

WSOP dealing: "We depend on the WSOP to make up for the rest of the year to keep us all fed till January. This 45 days of hard work is atleast 2/3 of most of our incomes."

Working 6 out of every 7 days during those 45 days, that adds up to $10k for the 45 days. Something doesn't seem right here.

[pkrporcupine]

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Since no one wants to say, I'll clear the air.

Dealers for the first two weeks made exactly the same down rate - $25.60/hour. That is a fact. The question is how many downs did the dealers get?

IN an 8-hour shift, if the dealers had a potential to get 16 downs but got only 10 instead, they made $256/day.

If they worked 5 days/week, they made 256 x 5 = 1230/week.
They also made 6.15/hr x 40 = 246/week.

Total per week = 1230 + 246 = 1476/week.

1476/week times 6 weeks = 8856.

I will leave it to the posters to decide if that is a fair number or not, but I have seen the paystubs of a few dealers, and it is anywhere from 8K to 10K, and that does not include any cash-game action they may or may not have dealt.

pkrporcupine - call my bluff and tell me these numbers are wrong. Tell me that $25.60/down is not accurate, tell me the average dealer didn't make 8K for 6 weeks????????

I know it and can prove it.

Look, Jesus Ferguson is a notorious non-toker. But, and if one is honest here, a lot of money is being jacked from the prize pool to toke dealers who simply are not very good.

I agree HET created a lot of bad will vis-a-vis toking, but fair is fair, 8-10 dimes for 6 weeks work is pretty damn good.

If dealers are treated so badly - QUIT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

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If you go back a little ways, I posted pretty much the same thing (numbers a little dif, but same thing) so thanks for paying attention
I never said that I PERSONALLY want to be on the PAB, and I have only insulted those that have right out attacked me.
And still, i am happy with what I made and and how the tourney went.

[pkrporcupine]

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p,

"On a normal day.... This is called an "up/down" rotation and it was that way alot durring the week... Now lets imagine that this dealer works his full 8 hour shift... Now we will use the amount of $24... $267.28 for the day. It works out to be $33 and change/hour..."

Thank you for providing the detailed explanation. Using the numbers you provided, dealers dealing a typical 8-hour day during the WSOP would be making $33/hr at a $24/down rate and about $40/hr at a $30/down rate.

This is the type of information players need when giving feedback to Harrah's regarding dealer compensation as well as making their own decisions regarding personal tipping amounts.

So, a followup question. If tip amounts work out to be what you expect and they stay the same for next year, do you think most of the good dealers will return next year to work the WSOP?

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<font color="red">Yes they will most likely come back. also there are dealers that have worked this event every year now for 20 + years </font>

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$33 an hour for a typical work year of 2,000 hours is about 70k per year plus free food and rooms in fancy casino resorts.....

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Where do we get free rooms and food? Yes this year harrahs provided food to us which was way cool but there are only about 2 stops on the road that have an employee dining room that is close enough for us to get to on our breaks and only 2 places that provide rooms. The travelling dealer must pay for all expenses to and from events (there are some UK events that help out with that but only a few of us are hired to go), We must pay for all food, some places give us and employee discount but that is very rare. We must Pay for all rooming expenses, There are 2 places I know of that cover your room and there are some places that the local hotels will give you a discount and as for WSOP here in vegas and on the road, we are never allowed to stay on property unless you are upper mngmnt.
This is only stating some facts that you obv didnt know but Im sure you all will take it as me complaining lol

[pkrporcupine]

[ QUOTE ]
prkp,

Here's one thing I'm curious about that just plain doesn't add up for me.

dealer pay based on $24/down rate: "$267.28 for the day"

WSOP dealing: "We depend on the WSOP to make up for the rest of the year to keep us all fed till January. This 45 days of hard work is atleast 2/3 of most of our incomes."

Working 6 out of every 7 days during those 45 days, that adds up to $10k for the 45 days. Something doesn't seem right here.

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Im not sure exactly what you are asking here. Are you going by a post that I made an example of a normal day of dealing while they were on an "up/down" rotation? and what doesnt make sense? the numbers used or days worked or what? I really would like to answer the question if I could and im not trying to come across as a smart ass lol

[ike]

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prkp,

Here's one thing I'm curious about that just plain doesn't add up for me.

dealer pay based on $24/down rate: "$267.28 for the day"

WSOP dealing: "We depend on the WSOP to make up for the rest of the year to keep us all fed till January. This 45 days of hard work is atleast 2/3 of most of our incomes."

Working 6 out of every 7 days during those 45 days, that adds up to $10k for the 45 days. Something doesn't seem right here.

[/ QUOTE ]
Im not sure exactly what you are asking here. Are you going by a post that I made an example of a normal day of dealing while they were on an "up/down" rotation? and what doesnt make sense? the numbers used or days worked or what? I really would like to answer the question if I could and im not trying to come across as a smart ass lol

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if 10k is 2/3rds of your income then you make a total of 15k/year. you can't travel constantly, cover your own expenses, and live on 15k/year. so something doesn't add up. correct me if i'm wrong, but this seems to be diablo's point.

[Zetack]

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prkp,

Here's one thing I'm curious about that just plain doesn't add up for me.

dealer pay based on $24/down rate: "$267.28 for the day"

WSOP dealing: "We depend on the WSOP to make up for the rest of the year to keep us all fed till January. This 45 days of hard work is atleast 2/3 of most of our incomes."

Working 6 out of every 7 days during those 45 days, that adds up to $10k for the 45 days. Something doesn't seem right here.

[/ QUOTE ]
Im not sure exactly what you are asking here. Are you going by a post that I made an example of a normal day of dealing while they were on an "up/down" rotation? and what doesnt make sense? the numbers used or days worked or what? I really would like to answer the question if I could and im not trying to come across as a smart ass lol

[/ QUOTE ]

if 10k is 2/3rds of your income then you make a total of 15k/year. you can't travel constantly, cover your own expenses, and live on 15k/year. so something doesn't add up. correct me if i'm wrong, but this seems to be diablo's point.

[/ QUOTE ]

My assumption, and she can correct me if I'm wrong, was that the 2/3's number was a bit of hyperbole intended to indicate that they depend on making a lot of scratch during the intensive period of the WSOP to make up for the fact that a lot of the rest of the year is a lot slower, not that this was some exact percentage of their annual income.

[DrewDevil]

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p,

"On a normal day.... This is called an "up/down" rotation and it was that way alot durring the week... Now lets imagine that this dealer works his full 8 hour shift... Now we will use the amount of $24... $267.28 for the day. It works out to be $33 and change/hour..."

Thank you for providing the detailed explanation. Using the numbers you provided, dealers dealing a typical 8-hour day during the WSOP would be making $33/hr at a $24/down rate and about $40/hr at a $30/down rate.

This is the type of information players need when giving feedback to Harrah's regarding dealer compensation as well as making their own decisions regarding personal tipping amounts.

So, a followup question. If tip amounts work out to be what you expect and they stay the same for next year, do you think most of the good dealers will return next year to work the WSOP?

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<font color="red">Yes they will most likely come back. also there are dealers that have worked this event every year now for 20 + years </font>

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$33 an hour for a typical work year of 2,000 hours is about 70k per year plus free food and rooms in fancy casino resorts.....

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Where do we get free rooms and food? Yes this year harrahs provided food to us which was way cool but there are only about 2 stops on the road that have an employee dining room that is close enough for us to get to on our breaks and only 2 places that provide rooms. The travelling dealer must pay for all expenses to and from events (there are some UK events that help out with that but only a few of us are hired to go), We must pay for all food, some places give us and employee discount but that is very rare. We must Pay for all rooming expenses, There are 2 places I know of that cover your room and there are some places that the local hotels will give you a discount and as for WSOP here in vegas and on the road, we are never allowed to stay on property unless you are upper mngmnt.
This is only stating some facts that you obv didnt know but Im sure you all will take it as me complaining lol

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You've done nothing but complain this entire thread. Usually it takes the form of "I'm happy with what I made this year, BUT WHINE WHINE COMPLAIN BITCH BITCH JESUS FERGUSON OMG WTF BBQ."

Prime example here: "Yes, Harrah's paid for our food, BUT OTHER PLACES DON'T AND WE HAVE TO WALK A LONG WAY TO THE BUFFET!! WAH WAH WAH POOR ME DEALING CARDZ!"

It's really quite tiresome.

[Zetack]

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p,

"On a normal day.... This is called an "up/down" rotation and it was that way alot durring the week... Now lets imagine that this dealer works his full 8 hour shift... Now we will use the amount of $24... $267.28 for the day. It works out to be $33 and change/hour..."

Thank you for providing the detailed explanation. Using the numbers you provided, dealers dealing a typical 8-hour day during the WSOP would be making $33/hr at a $24/down rate and about $40/hr at a $30/down rate.

This is the type of information players need when giving feedback to Harrah's regarding dealer compensation as well as making their own decisions regarding personal tipping amounts.

So, a followup question. If tip amounts work out to be what you expect and they stay the same for next year, do you think most of the good dealers will return next year to work the WSOP?

[/ QUOTE ]

<font color="red">Yes they will most likely come back. also there are dealers that have worked this event every year now for 20 + years </font>

[/ QUOTE ]

$33 an hour for a typical work year of 2,000 hours is about 70k per year plus free food and rooms in fancy casino resorts.....

[/ QUOTE ]
Where do we get free rooms and food? Yes this year harrahs provided food to us which was way cool but there are only about 2 stops on the road that have an employee dining room that is close enough for us to get to on our breaks and only 2 places that provide rooms. The travelling dealer must pay for all expenses to and from events (there are some UK events that help out with that but only a few of us are hired to go), We must pay for all food, some places give us and employee discount but that is very rare. We must Pay for all rooming expenses, There are 2 places I know of that cover your room and there are some places that the local hotels will give you a discount and as for WSOP here in vegas and on the road, we are never allowed to stay on property unless you are upper mngmnt.
This is only stating some facts that you obv didnt know but Im sure you all will take it as me complaining lol

[/ QUOTE ]

You've done nothing but complain this entire thread. Usually it takes the form of "I'm happy with what I made this year, BUT WHINE WHINE COMPLAIN BITCH BITCH JESUS FERGUSON OMG WTF BBQ."

Prime example here: "Yes, Harrah's paid for our food, BUT OTHER PLACES DON'T AND WE HAVE TO WALK A LONG WAY TO THE BUFFET!! WAH WAH WAH POOR ME DEALING CARDZ!"

It's really quite tiresome.

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Geez, here we have an inside source willing to provide details on things many of us our curious about (what happened in the pay-out room with the WSOP champion, dealer compensation, etc.) Heck, if she enjoyed these forums maybe she'd stick around and give us insights from the final table, NVG stories about dealing to pros, or who knows what else.

Instead we have to attack her for what, wanting to make more money at her chosen profession? Heck, I want to make more money at my chosen profession and I have no doubt that I make a good deal more money than she does.

Now she hasn't helped herself here, obviously, by being shrill and defensive, but bottom line, what's the problem here, that she would've preferred Ferguson didn't talk Jerry out of potentially leaving a big tip? I'd be surprised if any of the readers here, in her shoes, wouldn't have been disappointed if that happened. Heck who doesn't like more money?

I hate to defend her, after all she called me tacky in this thead, but the level of venom directed at her seems all out of proportion to what she's done.

Also, as an aside, I don't think your second example can even remotely be considered her complaining as she was correcting a false assumption somebody else made about food and housing.

By the by, if anybody is interested, it looks like the average salary for RN's with three years of experience is 47K and for Nurse Practitioners is about $62,000. I don't know what the higher or lower bounds of nurse compensation are, but on the other hand, I don't know what the higher and lower bounds of compensation for dealers is either.

--Zetack

Edit, on review of a few more sources it looks like I'm probably low on Nurses salaries:

The median national annual salary for an RN employed full-time in 2005 was $53,600 (U.S Dept. of Labor, Bureau of Labor Statistics).