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#31
11-26-2007, 10:39 AM
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Re: My Dad\'s [censored] Union
[ QUOTE ]
If the company is playing hardball with the reduced second contract it sounds like they are trying to get rid of the union anyway. I doubt that anything better could have been negotiated. They probably don't want to overpay for these jobs, and have figured out a way around the problem. Hopefully thats not the case and you Dad will be back at work shortly. [/ QUOTE ] Playing hardball? The company offered what they felt was a generous offer and got slapped in the face by the union in return. 
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#32
11-26-2007, 10:47 AM
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Re: My Dad\'s [censored] Union
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[ QUOTE ] My Dad will go down with the union, even if losing his job means he doesn't have a shot in hell of getting the diabetes treatment he needs. [/ QUOTE ] He's not going down with the union, he's going down with a few morons who are risking their jobs (and the jobs of their fellow union members) because their new boss is a pain in the ass. A union is made up of people. It's not a thing that deserves loyalty in and of itself. If the people in the union all start acting like idiots, it may be time to rethink one's loyalties. [/ QUOTE ] I think people are being a little naive to suggest that the father can just walk out on the Teamsters and scab during a strike. It's not the mob days any more, but he could expect union fines, social ostracism, or even physical intimidation/violence.
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#33
11-26-2007, 11:30 AM
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Re: My Dad\'s [censored] Union
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] [ QUOTE ] My Dad will go down with the union, even if losing his job means he doesn't have a shot in hell of getting the diabetes treatment he needs. [/ QUOTE ] He's not going down with the union, he's going down with a few morons who are risking their jobs (and the jobs of their fellow union members) because their new boss is a pain in the ass. A union is made up of people. It's not a thing that deserves loyalty in and of itself. If the people in the union all start acting like idiots, it may be time to rethink one's loyalties. [/ QUOTE ] I think people are being a little naive to suggest that the father can just walk out on the Teamsters and scab during a strike. It's not the mob days any more, but he could expect union fines, social ostracism, or even physical intimidation/violence. [/ QUOTE ] as well he should. You don't scab for the boss in situations like this. You solve it in-house. If I don't like the president of the US, I don't join Al Qaeda. I deal with it in-house.
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#34
11-26-2007, 12:08 PM
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Re: My Dad\'s [censored] Union
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] [ QUOTE ] [ QUOTE ] My Dad will go down with the union, even if losing his job means he doesn't have a shot in hell of getting the diabetes treatment he needs. [/ QUOTE ] He's not going down with the union, he's going down with a few morons who are risking their jobs (and the jobs of their fellow union members) because their new boss is a pain in the ass. A union is made up of people. It's not a thing that deserves loyalty in and of itself. If the people in the union all start acting like idiots, it may be time to rethink one's loyalties. [/ QUOTE ] I think people are being a little naive to suggest that the father can just walk out on the Teamsters and scab during a strike. It's not the mob days any more, but he could expect union fines, social ostracism, or even physical intimidation/violence. [/ QUOTE ] as well he should. You don't scab for the boss in situations like this. You solve it in-house. If I don't like the president of the US, I don't join Al Qaeda. I deal with it in-house. [/ QUOTE ] Yeah screw that ass for trying to do his job for what he thinks is a good deal without suffering intimidation. How selfish is he not wanting to lose his medical coverage over the petty squabbles of a group of people he doesn't know.
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#35
11-26-2007, 12:25 PM
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Re: My Dad\'s [censored] Union
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] [ QUOTE ] [ QUOTE ] My Dad will go down with the union, even if losing his job means he doesn't have a shot in hell of getting the diabetes treatment he needs. [/ QUOTE ] He's not going down with the union, he's going down with a few morons who are risking their jobs (and the jobs of their fellow union members) because their new boss is a pain in the ass. A union is made up of people. It's not a thing that deserves loyalty in and of itself. If the people in the union all start acting like idiots, it may be time to rethink one's loyalties. [/ QUOTE ] I think people are being a little naive to suggest that the father can just walk out on the Teamsters and scab during a strike. It's not the mob days any more, but he could expect union fines, social ostracism, or even physical intimidation/violence. [/ QUOTE ] as well he should. You don't scab for the boss in situations like this. You solve it in-house. If I don't like the president of the US, I don't join Al Qaeda. I deal with it in-house. [/ QUOTE ] You are advocating violence and threats against someone for wanting to do a job? Awesome.
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#36
11-26-2007, 12:39 PM
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Re: My Dad\'s [censored] Union
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] [ QUOTE ] [ QUOTE ] My Dad will go down with the union, even if losing his job means he doesn't have a shot in hell of getting the diabetes treatment he needs. [/ QUOTE ] He's not going down with the union, he's going down with a few morons who are risking their jobs (and the jobs of their fellow union members) because their new boss is a pain in the ass. A union is made up of people. It's not a thing that deserves loyalty in and of itself. If the people in the union all start acting like idiots, it may be time to rethink one's loyalties. [/ QUOTE ] I think people are being a little naive to suggest that the father can just walk out on the Teamsters and scab during a strike. It's not the mob days any more, but he could expect union fines, social ostracism, or even physical intimidation/violence. [/ QUOTE ] as well he should. You don't scab for the boss in situations like this. You solve it in-house. If I don't like the president of the US, I don't join Al Qaeda. I deal with it in-house. [/ QUOTE ] His first alliances are with his family. I have a feeling that he is the breadwinner in the house(leigihigh can correct me if wrong) and his first duty is to take care of them. If that means crossing a picket line so they can eat then so be it.
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#37
11-26-2007, 12:39 PM
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Re: My Dad\'s [censored] Union
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] Well, if sticking to principle only means sticking to them when it is in your best interest, we're obviously operating with two different version of the word principle. [/ QUOTE ] This is the problem. A union exists to always protect the workers. I am having trouble envisioning when a union should do something that isn't in its members best interest. [/ QUOTE ] A union exists to collect union dues and control vast sums of money. To think the union will always (or even usually)act in the best interest of it's membership is naive.
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#38
11-26-2007, 12:55 PM
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Re: My Dad\'s [censored] Union
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] [ QUOTE ] Well, if sticking to principle only means sticking to them when it is in your best interest, we're obviously operating with two different version of the word principle. [/ QUOTE ] This is the problem. A union exists to always protect the workers. I am having trouble envisioning when a union should do something that isn't in its members best interest. [/ QUOTE ] A union exists to collect union dues and control vast sums of money. To think the union will always (or even usually)act in the best interest of it's membership is naive. [/ QUOTE ] It starts out so honest which is the saddest part, but I guess that is the case with everything. Start out just trying to help out people, then it gets bogged down with actual human beings.
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#39
11-26-2007, 02:47 PM
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Re: My Dad\'s [censored] Union
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] [ QUOTE ] Well, if sticking to principle only means sticking to them when it is in your best interest, we're obviously operating with two different version of the word principle. [/ QUOTE ] Cults have principles. The principle of being brain-washed into sticking with something even when it makes your life worse. I wouldn't use such strong language except for the fact that he might not be able to get his diabetes treated and the union is being plainly moronic. [/ QUOTE ] The principle is solidarity. It means sticking by your fellow men for the benefit of the slackers and the detriment of the most productive people. Union men don't cut and run when things go south. They don't talk anti-union talk or turn on their fellow workers. A decicated, perpetual slacker knows that he can continue to be unproductive as long as the union can cover for him. [/ QUOTE ] FYP
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#40
11-26-2007, 04:08 PM
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Re: My Dad\'s [censored] Union
Adios, what makes you think productive workers don't get anything out of unions? I'll bet that excluding independent contractors, lehighguy's dad makes more than the best non-union driver in the city.
You guys are talking about "Oh noes, he might lose his job!!!", but that is so standard. People quit jobs all the time because of crappy bosses. People lose jobs all the time because of salary disagreements. The situation is much better from the worker's POV in a union because with a union, there is actually a chance they can get what they want without quitting.
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