5/10 turn semibluff vs good regular

[jfish]

if hes good, he should be firing KK here. and when people are betting such a huge range (bluffs/value) here, theyre are folding a TON of it to aggression. (this might be basic i havent read other replies)

[Triumph36]

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if hes good, he should be firing KK here. and when people are betting such a huge range (bluffs/value) here, theyre are folding a TON of it to aggression. (this might be basic i havent read other replies)

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not basic based on the replies so far

villain should bet like 95% of his range here, it's true

and that's why this shove is awesome

and luego is right re: AK, and you probably should've posted it that way.

[aislephive]

I never said villain will snap call any ace here, I'm saying a good villain will be able to make this kind of call with AK/AJ if they put you on the kind of hand you have. Just because you don't think he should be calling you with AK here doesn't mean that he won't, regardless if you play AQ/A5 the same way. I see GP doing that in his CR vids all the time, making some bluff/semi-bluff and then when he gets called he says stuff like "well I'd play two pair or a straight the same way" to justify his play being good. Villain knows that this is such an obvious card to second barrell, and he knows you know that of course, so when he fires the turn and you shove for an overbet like this on a very drawy board it's going to arouse a lot of suspicion. I know that I will double barrell a turned top pair against a lot of aggressive players hoping to get raised or shoved on. This is a bit deeper though which makes me hate it less (I think this would be pretty bad 100bbs deep no question), but I don't know. Just seems like you are going to show up with a draw a lot of the time here given the dynamics of the hand.

But yeah, obviously if he is bet/folding all Ax hands on the turn then your shove is fine. I just think that's wishful thinking, personally.

[thac]

He's trying to argue the fact that villain shows up with air a lot here. I'm including KK as air here for simplicity's sake, but it's just not very likely you have an ace here unless it's AhXh and I don't think you shove that because you turn your hand into a bluff unless he DOES call with KK. I mean it just depends how deep he's reading into your line. So if he knows you don't shove a suited ace there, he can call with KK but if he thinks you're gonna shove with a suited ace he's not gonna.. and I guess since you're a lagtard according to other posters here, you're gonna shove the scare-card.

Meh just rambling now is my thought process bad?

[aislephive]

Obviously villain will have air here a fair amount, but the crux of this hand is how villain will respond with something like AK, as our shove is for another > $1100, how often he calls with his non air hands is huge.

[Morrek]

If you're sure he's firing like 90+% of his range on the turn, and might fold like KQ to your c/r, then it's good. But do you really know all this? None is stated in the op(haven't read all replies).

Also your image is obv important and if he thinks you repop aq pre 100% then its not that good. Oh and man it'd suck if/when he has Axhh

[Parlay Slow]

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Obviously villain will have air here a fair amount, but the crux of this hand is how villain will respond with something like AK, as our shove is for another > $1100, how often he calls with his non air hands is huge.

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why is the crux of the hand how he'll respond with AK instead of how often he has air? because our "shove is for another > $1100"? And?

That's a pretty lazy post

[tcorbin16]

we all know luego didnt really do this and hit the fold button, with that said i really dont like this. if you had like at least some sort of combo draw/pair + fd id like it a lot more but not 8 high...

[aislephive]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Obviously villain will have air here a fair amount, but the crux of this hand is how villain will respond with something like AK, as our shove is for another > $1100, how often he calls with his non air hands is huge.

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why is the crux of the hand how he'll respond with AK instead of how often he has air? because our "shove is for another > $1100"? And?

That's a pretty lazy post

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We're shoving twice what's in the pot currently when he probably folds air to any raise. Obviously his calling range is a lot less defined than his turn betting range, and I would say most people are betting close to their entire range on the turn, but I have no idea how often he is betting the flop with air into two people on this board. Against some players they simply aren't cbetting this flop that often here, so they're not getting to the turn with air that often like this to begin with, and relying on fold equity against a range of strong hands on this board seems suicidal. This is too read dependant of a hand anyways, not to mention you need to calculate how often he has air assuming he bets 90% of his opening range on the flop or however much you think he bets. Some guys even check the turn with Ax or Qx, some bet with stuff as weak as 99. Without knowing all of that, it's impossible to come to any reasonable conclusion of how good or bad this is. In a vaccum, I think it's spewy.

But another brilliant contribution from you, picking apart somebody else's post with no insight of your own. Keep up the good work. I can only hope your coaching is as effective.

[DJ Sensei]

I dont know, seems like he's not gonna fold much here. Yea he'll 2barrel a lot, but, he also hit an ace a lot. depends what he thinks of you i guess.