($11 Stars) KQ Bubble Call

Mike MacIntosh · #1 10-27-2006, 04:46 PM

This hand happened a couple of days ago while I was multi-tabling, so no reads unforunately. I am trying to figure out if this call is +EV, but I do not have a firm understanding of ICM (I have done some reading but it is not sinking in). Could someone break this problem down via ICM? I would greatly appreciate it.

Would you call or fold in this spot? Please explain.

PokerStars Tournament, Big Blind is t200 with t25 antes (4 handed) Converter on pregopoker.com

CO (t2075)
Button (t6615)
SB (t1430)
Hero (t3380)

Preflop: Hero is in BB with K[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] Q[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]
CO folds, Button folds, SB raises to t1405 (All-in), Hero calls t1205

ddg333 · #2 10-27-2006, 05:06 PM

The answer is it depends on your opponent. If he is the type to be pushing 30%+ there (he should be doing more) then it's an easy call. If his range is restricted to just aces and pairs it becomes an easy fold. It's a breakeven call if he's pushing 25% (QTs+, K8s+, KTo+, any ace, any pair) Get one of the free calculators out there and try it out for yourself. The bubble makes for some interesting game theory.

DaN_05 · #3 10-27-2006, 07:24 PM

This is an interesting case where it's actually an easier call at higher buy-ins. In an $11 they often aren't pushing as much as they should be, as ddg333 says it all depends on his range when you're playing in game. If you think he's pushing pretty wide it's an easy call. If he's open-folded to you twice before or something it's probably a fold.

Mike MacIntosh · #4 10-28-2006, 02:54 PM

I appreciate the input guys. Does any know the ICM math to figure out the x% that we would need to call for this to be neutral EV?

Mike MacIntosh · #5 10-29-2006, 10:58 AM

Are there any ICM buffs out there that can help me with this?

Finnisher · #6 10-29-2006, 06:30 PM

[ QUOTE ]
I appreciate the input guys. Does any know the ICM math to figure out the x% that we would need to call for this to be neutral EV?

[/ QUOTE ]
SB pushes a%, you call b%. Give a or b and the other one can be solved.

Mike MacIntosh · #7 10-29-2006, 06:32 PM

Lets say he pushes with any pair, any Q high or better, and any suited connector.

Finnisher · #8 10-29-2006, 06:49 PM

[ QUOTE ]
Lets say he pushes with any pair, any Q high or better, and any suited connector.

[/ QUOTE ]
SB pushes: 22+,A2+,K2+,Q2+,53s+,54s+

You call: 22+,A2+,K8o+,K6s+,QJo,QTs+

I'll try working on some pen'n'paper ICM details, those ranges are courtesy of SNGPT [img]/images/graemlins/tongue.gif[/img]

Finnisher · #9 10-29-2006, 07:28 PM

[ QUOTE ]
I'll try working on some pen'n'paper ICM details

[/ QUOTE ]
I tried. You need to win 53,81% if you call (ignoring ties). But Pokerstoveing the ranges seems to take a long time. Get SNGPT [img]/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]

Is there a shortcut to finding the calling range with PStove before noon (GMT+2)?

morgan180 · #10 10-29-2006, 10:33 PM

the problem w/KQ and hands such as this are that at the $11s any Ax hand is a big pushing favorite. i've found that is one of the adjustments i've had to make at the $5s - you'll see A4 here so often it will make you puke.

Here's a link to deathgrind's post on ICM and calculating it by hand: http://archiveserver.twoplustwo.com/show...o=14&fpart=