Live 20/40 -- Weak-tight or just right?

[Garland]

Location: Casino Arizona in Scottsdale, AZ
Stakes: $20/$40
Players: Loose aggressive game. It’s loose, but not quite as loose as the better Bay 101 or Commerce games tonight. Fairly aggressive game, of the likes I haven’t seen in awhile. Not tricky aggressive. On flop betting, you can expect callers for a single bet with just overs. I can only give it a borderline *** of 5 stars.

Principal players:

UTG – Dealer I later find out his name is “Billy”. I’ve only played with him for an hour or so. At the very time of playing this hand, I find he’s somewhat loose aggressive, but I don’t have any reason to believe he’d be too far out of line (until another half hour/hour).

SB – A relatively new player. I don’t know too much about him.

BB – Me.

Preflop: (1.5 small bets, 9 players)

UTG raises, 3 other callers including SB who cold-calls. I find 8[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]8[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] and complete.

Flop: (10 small bets, 5 players) 5[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]4[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]3[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]

I’m thinking of betting out when SB does it first! I look left to get a read, but cannot. I suspect there will be callers if I just call. So it’s raise or fold, so I just fold? Weak tight or just right?

All comments appreciated. Results to come.

Garland

[jfk]

I'd prefer a raise and an attempt to clear out the field and hopefully get against a SB leading with his A5.

If you get three bet by UTG it'll tell you a lot. Assuming that they've seen you show down hands which make sense, I think you can drive out a lot of hands or learn that you're drawing thin or dead.

I would tend to raise as there aren't a lot of non-8 flops which are much better for 88 in a big field.

The SB lead is the best possible thing in the world for you. I'd take advantage of your good fortune with a raise.

[private joker]

Yeah, 543 is a terrible flop for 88, turbo muck.







No, but seriously. This is a raise. SB is unknown, and donking here is common practice with hands like 65/75/64/63 and plenty of other non-set hands people in the SB have.

Also your preflop action doesn't make sense. UTG raises, SB limps, and you complete?

Even if SB has 2 pair, you have plenty of outs against it. And you'd love UTG to fold AK/AQ hands, since you don't want to see any overcards on the turn.

There are 11SBs in the pot after SB donks. I think the pot is big enough here to not fold an overpair. Raise the flop and see what happens. If UTG 3-bets his hand is pretty obvious as an overpair that beats yours. If SB 3-bets you can slow down considerably and maybe find a fold UI on the river.

[BadBigBabar]

this is an easy raise

[Garland]

[ QUOTE ]
Also your preflop action doesn't make sense. UTG raises, SB limps, and you complete?

[/ QUOTE ]

Sorry, I fixed a word. SB "cold-calls". It's been raised and there are 10 small bets in the pot.

[ QUOTE ]
SB is unknown, and donking here is common practice with hands like 65/75/64/63

[/ QUOTE ]

Do you really think these trash hands make up a big part of his range? For example, 63 is very iffy (even if suited) and the one gappers are kind of iffy although I can see a call if they are suited.

Garland

[jfk]

[ QUOTE ]
Also your preflop action doesn't make sense. UTG raises, SB limps, and you complete?

[/ QUOTE ]

...there are 3 other limpers. Garland may be a lot of things, but he knows how to format a hand history.

[that_pope]

Insta raise, and win the hand unimproved!

I never fold here in a million billion years unless someone shows me 33, 44, 55, 99, TT, JJ, QQ, KK, AA, A2, 26, 67 and asks me to fold.

[Captain R]

I honestly don't care what SB has here. He could have TT, 99, A6, 65, 66, 77, 22, 54, 43, whatever...

The only way I wouldn't raise this flop is if a raise wouldn't clear the field, in which case I would pop the turn if the flop action didn't go too crazy.

[NinaWilliams]

Id raise it too for reasons outlined above. I dont think the fold is that horrible though. Like if UTG was a tight player I think a fold is probably correct.

[Garland]

Thoughts:

I didn't know Billy was a lagtard here at the time, and SB betting into the field seemed strong to me. He's likely to have top pair, two pair, straight or an overpair like 66 or 77 which I beat, or an overpair that beats me such as 99, TT or JJ. I guess, I would have raised with 99 or better, but I was worried about the potential of UTG having a larger overpair which he would never, ever fold.

Results:

I folded to the flop bet original raiser folded and there was a call in two spots. Turn was bet and called in a spot or two and the river was checked through. The board came two overs to my 8, but SB's 77 held up in the end.

Thanks for your thoughts,

Garland