Ultimate Bet quietly stealing my money

[pocketAAAA]

Some days ago I received an error while trying to login to my UB account. I contacted their customer service, and this was their answer:

[ QUOTE ]
----- Original Message -----
From: <support@ultimatebet.com>
To: <removed>
Sent: Thursday, October 11, 2007 8:24 PM
Subject: RE:Error message when trying to login [#6875954]

>
> Dear M. XXXXXX,
>
> Thank you for contacting us.
>
> According to our share negative database, your account has been disabled because your account at AbsolutePoker has been disabled. In order for you to have access to your UB account, you need to get in contact with AbsolutePoker and fix any pending issue you may have with them.
>
> Thank you for understanding and please let us know if you require further assistance.
>
> Best regards,
>
> Vinnie
> Ultimate Bet ~ Security Department
> 'The Ultimate Poker Experience'

[/ QUOTE ]

Now, I don’t have an account at AP. I had an account at Big Chip Poker though (AP skin), where I played few hands (maybe less than 100). When I pulled out my money from Big Chip poker I had some issues, because I tried to use different e-wallets (click2pay and Neteller, I think) to deposit and withdraw. It took some days to clarify, but all went OK. It was February 21st, 2007 when I received their latest email:

[ QUOTE ]
----- Original Message -----
From: <security@absolutepoker.com>
To: <removed>
Sent: Wednesday, February 21, 2007 5:28 AM
Subject: RE:Fwd:RE:my withdrawal [#5457525] (and my documents)

>
> Dear Mr. XXXXX,
>
> Thank you for your email.
>
> Please note that the withdrawal request already been processed.
>
> If there is anything else we can assist you with please let us know.
>
> Sincerely,
>
> Alexander
> Team Absolute ~ Security & Control Department
> Phone: 1.877.887.6537
> "To Continue to be the best and most trusted"
> Security@AbsolutePoker.Com
>
> We're Here To Stay! All Players Welcome!
>
> Enter the Absolute Dream Package tournament and win your way into 10 of the biggest poker games in the world! For more details, click here:
>
> http://www.absolutepoker.com/promoti...am-package.asp
>
> --Original Message--
> From: removed
> Date: 02/20/07
> To: security@absolutepoker.com
> Subject: RE:Fwd:RE:my withdrawal [#5457525] (and my documents)
>
> Dear Alexander,
>
> now you have my documents, so all should be OK, but my money are not back to my account yet. Please unblock them as soon as possible, or let me know what else you need to unblock them.
> Regards
> XXXXXX

[/ QUOTE ]

So I tried to solve this issue, and sent a first email to AP:

[ QUOTE ]
----- Original Message -----
From: "XXXXXXXX" <removed>
To: <security@absolutepoker.com>
Cc: <support@ultimatebet.com>
Sent: Thursday, October 11, 2007 9:04 PM
Subject: Dear Absolute, do we have an issue? Referred to UltimateBet issue [#6875954]

> Dear Absolute,
> my account at Ultimate Bet has been blocked. They say this is because:
> "According to our share negative database, your account has been disabled
> because your account at AbsolutePoker has been disabled. In order for you to
> have access to your UB account, you need to get in contact with
> AbsolutePoker and fix any pending issue you may have with them."
>
> Now, I remember I had an account at Big Chip Poker (user: XXXXX), while I
> don't even remember if I had an account at Absolute skin... however, if I
> had, I never or almost never used it.
>
> We had an issue regarding a withdrawal, but it was solved. However I'll
> paste all the emails sent in that occasion (February 2007). Please solve
> this situation quickly, I don't understand why you blocked my accounts when
> I don't even play there. I'm an estimated customer at UB, I repeat, solve
> this situation quickly. And please send your answer to UltimateBet support,
> too.
> Thanks
> XXXXXXX

[/ QUOTE ]

They didn’t answer me. So I sent a second email, to both poker rooms:

[ QUOTE ]
----- Original Message -----
From: "XXXXXXX" <removed>
To: <support@ultimatebet.com>; <security@absolutepoker.com>
Sent: Sunday, October 14, 2007 9:47 AM
Subject: Fw: Dear Absolute, do we have an issue? Referred to UltimateBet issue [#6875954]

> To Absolute: so when will you take care of this? three days passed already
> and I didn't hear from you.
>
> To Ultimate Bet, that gets this message too: please re-activate my account.
> I've always been a good customer. I don't know what the hell these guys at
> Absolute are thinking, I don't open their poker room since February. They
> don't even answer to my emails, as you can see. In any case, let me know how
> you think to proceed... I had some money in my UB account.
>
> An Extremely frustrated (and on the verge to play elsewhere)
>
> XXXXXXX

[/ QUOTE ]

Today, UB answered, and we started a sort of fight:

[ QUOTE ]
Dear Alexander,

Thank you for contacting us.

As stated in previous emails, your account at UB can not be reactivated because it has been blocked by our shared security system. As long as your AP account is shown as blocked, you will not be able to access any of the sites sharing this negative database.

Thank you for understanding and please let us know if you require further assistance.

Best regards,

Vinne
UltimateBet ~ Security Department
'The Ultimate Poker Experience'

[/ QUOTE ]

[ QUOTE ]
Dear Vinne,
my name is Andrea, but that's not that important, I guess, unless my
identity has been stolen.
Please take five minutes and consider my situation.

I have been blocked by your room because my AP account has been blocked.

1. I do not, will repeat, DO NOT, have an account at AP.
2. I had an account at Big Chip Poker (AP skin) where I played just few
hands.
3. When I pulled out my money from Big Chip Poker, an issue came out because
I used two different e-wallets to deposit/withdraw, but the issue was solved
in some days.
4. The latest email I received from them was on Feb. 21st, 2007, confirming
my withdrawal, and I have never played there again.
5. I didn't receive any communication about the fact my account there was
blocked.
6. I have sent them some emails in these days, but never received answer.

I don't want to spend my money to make an international call to ask them.
I'm Italian, and have some difficulties in speaking English by phone
especially with such a delicate situation.

So, I gently ask you to contact AP and at least let me know what's the
reason why I have an issue with them. I don't plan to send them any other
email until they answer me, and they don't seem to plan to do it.

If you can't do this for some internal rule, or if you just are so blind to
believe in a database compiled by a site that, if you read 2+2 forums, as
you should, is even suspected to cheat their customers running superuser
accounts, then you don't deserve to be my preferred poker room, so please
proceed to close my account at UB immediately, and send me back my money,
either through Neteller or Moneybookers, which you prefer.

Regards

XXXXXXX

[/ QUOTE ]

[ QUOTE ]
Dear Andrea,

Thank you for contacting us.

Unfortunately there is nothing we can do about this because you are the one who had an issue with them. In order to clear things up, you need to get in contact with them to find out the reason why they have you blocked. Again, all we can see is that you have been blocked to access any website sharing this negative database, and you need to get in contact with Big Chip Poker in order to resolve any pending issue you may have with them.

Please let us know if you require further assistance.

Best regards,

Vinnie
UltimateBet ~ Security Department
'The Ultimate Poker Experience'

[/ QUOTE ]

[ QUOTE ]
As I said, they don't answer me. As I said, I won't call them by phone,
because:
1. I'm Italian and I have some difficulties to speak/understand English
2. I don't want to spend money to solve an issue with a poker room I'm not
interested in

So, if this is your position, close my account and send my money back to my
Neteller/Moneybookers account, as I said. I have accounts at many poker
rooms, and none of them blocked me, so I'll play there instead of UB.

I'm waiting

Regards
XXXXXXX

[/ QUOTE ]

[ QUOTE ]
Dear Andrea,

Thank you for contacting us.

Unfortunately your account is currently disabled and no transactions can be processed unless this issue has been clarified.

Please let us know if you require further assistance.

Best regards,

Vinnie
UltimateBet ~ Security Department
'The Ultimate Poker Experience'

[/ QUOTE ]

[ QUOTE ]
Wrong answer Vinnie. Those are my money. If you don't want to hear from my
lawyer (I have a lot of money to spend just to bother you if you want, even
for $50, it's the principle that counts), close my account now and don't
reiterate your stupid answers.

I don't have any issue with UB, and you can't force me to solve an issue
with a third party I'm not interested in.

I'm still waiting.
Regards
Andrea

[/ QUOTE ]

Again, minutes ago, their stupid answer:

[ QUOTE ]
Dear Andrea,

Thank you for contacting us.

As stated in previous emails, your account is currently disabled and no transactions will be completed while it is blocked.

Please let us know if you require further assistance.

Best regards,

Vinnie
UltimateBet ~ Security Department
'The Ultimate Poker Experience'

[/ QUOTE ]

[SmokeyRidesAgain]

*head asplodes*

[1p0kerboy]

Just one of the many reasons to avoid these rogue sites.

Seriously, find somewhere else to play.

[NL__Fool]

UB accepting your money then not refunding it because there is an issue at a a completely different poker site is retarded, and completely wrong by them. If they can not refund it they should not have accepted it in the 1st place.

How did you deposit? By credit card? Is there any way you can dispute the transaction.


[ QUOTE ]
Wrong answer Vinnie. Those are my money. If you don't want to hear from my
lawyer (I have a lot of money to spend just to bother you if you want, even
for $50, it's the principle that counts), close my account now and don't
reiterate your stupid answers.

I don't have any issue with UB, and you can't force me to solve an issue
with a third party I'm not interested in.

I'm still waiting.
Regards
Andrea


[/ QUOTE ]

This e-mail here just blew any chance you had of getting your money out without a hassle. I'm not saying you won't get it out, but that e-mail makes me laugh, you made a laughable pathetic empty threat that can't, and won't be backed up by you. No one will go through the time, effort and expense to recover $50 when it will cost them tens of thousands to to so even if your fees are recovered in the end.

It's not like you can go to small claims court over this. Your talking about a civil matter between two completely different countries with two completely different laws which, if you do sue will cost you tens of thousands.

A lot of the times you will get better results being nice, rational and not making threats, then you will with the attitude you adopted in your email. You do have every right to be pissed however.

Also, by the tone of your e-mails you seem to know the english launguage well enough to speak it fluently.

[NL__Fool]

[ QUOTE ]
Just one of the many reasons to avoid these rogue sites

[/ QUOTE ]

Wasn't UB one of the bigger and well known sites back in the day?

When I started 4 years ago they seemed like they were one of the bigger ones but then I found Party poker and never went back, I also didn't know much back then

[pocketAAAA]

[ QUOTE ]
UB accepting your money then not refunding it because there is an issue at a a completely different poker site is retarded, and completely wrong by them. If they can not refund it they should not have accepted it in the 1st place.

How did you deposit? By credit card? Is there any way you can dispute the transaction.


[ QUOTE ]
Wrong answer Vinnie. Those are my money. If you don't want to hear from my
lawyer (I have a lot of money to spend just to bother you if you want, even
for $50, it's the principle that counts), close my account now and don't
reiterate your stupid answers.

I don't have any issue with UB, and you can't force me to solve an issue
with a third party I'm not interested in.

I'm still waiting.
Regards
Andrea


[/ QUOTE ]

This e-mail here just blew any chance you had of getting your money out without a hassle. I'm not saying you won't get it out, but that e-mail makes me laugh, you made a laughable pathetic empty threat that can't, and won't be backed up by you. No one will go through the time, effort and expense to recover $50 when it will cost them tens of thousands to to so even if your fees are recovered in the end.

It's not like you can go to small claims court over this. Your talking about a civil matter between two completely different countries with two completely different laws which, if you do sue will cost you tens of thousands.

A lot of the times you will get better results being nice, rational and not making threats, then you will with the attitude you adopted in your email. You do have every right to be pissed however.

Also, by the tone of your e-mails you seem to know the english launguage well enough to speak it fluently.

[/ QUOTE ]

No I deposited and withdrawed through Neteller and Moneybookers several times, and had no issues till now.

Yes my mail is stupid, they made me nervous with their stupid answers.

I can write English quite well, (you're forced to, with internet and all), but believe me, when it comes to speaking I'm a disaster, I understand less than 50% of what one says by phone, unless he's a CNN anchorman, and I can't answer quickly. I know it's strange, lack of exercise, I guess.

[1p0kerboy]

[ QUOTE ]
Wasn't UB one of the bigger and well known sites back in the day?

When I started 4 years ago they seemed like they were one of the bigger ones but then I found Party poker and never went back, I also didn't know much back then


[/ QUOTE ]

A couple of years ago they got bought by the same group that owns Absolute Poker.

There is a huge scandal right now with one of the owners using an account that can see hole cards taking a bunch of money off people. Just today there were developments linking this account to Absolute Poker itself.

Everybody needs to get there money out of these 2 sites immediately.

[NL__Fool]

[ QUOTE ]
There is a huge scandal right now with one of the owners using an account that can see hole cards taking a bunch of money off people

[/ QUOTE ]

I scanned thru a lot of that post but I didnt see where it said the account holder was one of the owners of UB How did they discover that?

[HavanaBanana]

Remind them that if players deposits are not safe and are stolen by a site like this, the cost of other players avoiding the site will be much larger than your $50.

Send them the link to this thread, and also tell them that you will send a letter to the gaming commision where they are located if they do not return YOUR money.
I hate this kind of ignorance.
Good Luck.

ToT

[Cry Me A River]

[ QUOTE ]

I scanned thru a lot of that post but I didnt see where it said the account holder was one of the owners of UB How did they discover that?

[/ QUOTE ]

Start reading here:
http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/sh...age=0&vc=1