Stacking off with my pair of 4's

[cassette]

Villain is a good 22/17/4 player. He is very aggressive. This is a really weird line from him that I haven't seen before. What hand would he possible play like this that wasn't a draw?

I think this is a fold because there is a very loose player yet to act but if it was a tight player that we could trust to lay down a pair I would have loved to go for a hero call here.

No Limit Holdem Ring game
Blinds: $0.50/$1
6 players
Converter

Stack sizes:
UTG: $185.50
UTG+1: $83.48
CO: $111
Hero: $100.50
SB: $180.54
BB: $174.99

Pre-flop: (6 players) Hero is Button with 4[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 4[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]
<font color="#cc0000">UTG raises to $4</font>, 2 folds, Hero calls, SB calls, BB calls.

Flop: 5[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 3[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 3[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] ($16, 4 players)
SB checks, BB checks, UTG checks, <font color="#cc0000">Hero bets $12</font>, SB calls, BB folds, <font color="#cc0000">UTG raises all-in $181.5</font>, Hero folds, SB folds.
Uncalled bets: $169.5 returned to UTG.

Results:
Final pot: $52

[dirtytricks]

If he is any good this is never a draw. Fold.

[cassette]

Interesting. This is the exact opposite conclusion I came too. Care to elaborate on what range a good player would show up with here?

I don't like the play much regardless of his cards but this is much worse with any real hand than with a draw. Why would you check the best possible flop for your overpair 4 way? And then proceed to CR AI to fold every hand that you beat?

[dirtytricks]

His bet doesnt make sense but you cant call with 44.

If he has AA you look really silly and even two big diamonds is a coinflip. You never are good here.

I guess he could have 55 hoping some of you will call with a draw or a 3.

[Worm75]

Agree don't like the play much either, but I honestly seriously doubt that this is an overpair here. My guess is that you are looking at 55, or maybe even the 67 of diamonds here.

Looks more like a combo draw/set than anything else to me, but this is going to be villain dependant and you are going to know better than anyone what hit UTG raising range is.

[cassette]

[ QUOTE ]
His bet doesnt make sense but you cant call with 44.

If he has AA you look really silly and even two big diamonds is a coinflip. You never are good here.

I guess he could have 55 hoping some of you will call with a draw or a 3.

[/ QUOTE ]

I was mostly interested to hear why you think this is never a draw?

And I am a favorite over any draw, don't mind getting it in if I can be sure this guy isn't pulling the old 'I know I can't do this with a real hand, so I will,' maneuver.

I guess this hand isn't very interesting as it comes down almost entirely to the reads I have on the player.