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Old 01-01-2007, 07:51 PM
davebreal davebreal is offline
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Default PL 5 Card Draw, tournament/theoretical hand

I don't feel like digging up the Hand History, but I played the Stars $10+1 earlier also, and lost a of chips on this hand...

23355 UTG blinds were 100-200, and I was around 1900 in chips at the time.. 6-handed, loose-passive table with many people cold-calling.

Is this always a raise UTG? Limp?

Anyways, we took the draw 3-handed, I didn't improve, CO led out, button called, and like a stubborn fool I called also.
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  #2  
Old 01-01-2007, 07:54 PM
2461Badugi 2461Badugi is offline
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Default Re: PL 5 Card Draw, tournament/theortical hand

I would fold this PL.
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  #3  
Old 01-01-2007, 08:25 PM
Fiasco Fiasco is offline
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Default Re: PL 5 Card Draw, tournament/theoretical hand

While any two pair is usually worth opening from any position in limit 5CD, I think that low two pair UTG, at a loose passive table playing PL is EASILY a fold. Youre in a total reverse implied odds situation. Theres an argument for a limp if youre never going to get raised predraw because you could make a boat and get payed off, but the math is against you (especially given your M).

The overcall was godawful, just about nobody is going to value bet a hand you can beat in this situation (a raised multiway pot) and the chances that you can beat both the bettor and the first caller are horrible.
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Old 01-01-2007, 09:58 PM
Murakawa Murakawa is offline
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Default Re: PL 5 Card Draw, tournament/theoretical hand

Hmm this is tough. In a loose passive I have to agree that it's a fold. How are you compared to the other stacks? I might open raise the pot if I were really desperate in hope of just stealing the blinds. I know it's a risk but it might be worth it if you're desperate.

I think limping is a big big no-no, you're just asking people to come in for cheap and outdraw you.
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  #5  
Old 01-01-2007, 11:58 PM
Tom Bayes Tom Bayes is offline
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Default Re: PL 5 Card Draw, tournament/theoretical hand

Limping is very bad with this hand. I'd raise to steal the blinds. If you feel stealing is hopeless I'd fold since a 9.5BB stack isn't as desperate in draw as it is in holdem and this hand is impossible to do anything with after the swap unless you hit a boat.

Really Raise and Fold are pretty close and both are far superior to Call.

Fiasco is right about overcalling postdraw. Unimproved two small pair needs to be check-folded in this spot.
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  #6  
Old 01-02-2007, 12:06 AM
davebreal davebreal is offline
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Default Re: PL 5 Card Draw, tournament/theoretical hand

[ QUOTE ]
Limping is very bad with this hand. I'd raise to steal the blinds. If you feel stealing is hopeless I'd fold since a 9.5BB stack isn't as desperate in draw as it is in holdem and this hand is impossible to do anything with after the swap unless you hit a boat.

Really Raise and Fold are pretty close and both are far superior to Call.

Fiasco is right about overcalling postdraw. Unimproved two small pair needs to be check-folded in this spot.

[/ QUOTE ]

yeah, i did pot-it coming in... just wanted to see what the consensus on 2 baby pairs would be.. especially in EP.
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  #7  
Old 01-02-2007, 12:41 AM
Murakawa Murakawa is offline
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Default Re: PL 5 Card Draw, tournament/theoretical hand

Trust Tom Bayes here, he is best PL 5CD tourney player IMO
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  #8  
Old 01-02-2007, 02:43 AM
Uncle Wimp Uncle Wimp is offline
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Default Re: PL 5 Card Draw, tournament/theoretical hand

[ QUOTE ]
Trust Tom Bayes here, he is best PL 5CD tourney player IMO

[/ QUOTE ]
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  #9  
Old 01-02-2007, 03:26 AM
Tom Bayes Tom Bayes is offline
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Default Re: PL 5 Card Draw, tournament/theoretical hand

ty for the ridiculous praise.

Mura got 18th and I got 11th (both in the money) in the $22 5CD at Stars tonight (168 starters), so 2p2 did well on the first day of draw tourneys at Stars with Mark Gritter and Biggle doing well in 2-7, plus anyone else who might have had big finishes.
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