Penn and Teller on Walmart - Page 3

SNOWBALL · #21 04-01-2007, 11:54 PM

I resent that they claim that raising wages and benefits raises prices. That's like saying that when my bonii at absolute poker went down, my WR had to go up. wtf? The prices at walmart are set by market forces, and market forces are a lot more complex than maintaining a certain ROI for walmart.

I realize in a lot of cases, prices do go up to cover higher costs, but this wouldn't necesarrily be on of those cases. A number of things could happen. Walmart could pay more, but end up laying off some of the least useful jobs. They could pay more, make less profit, but still do fine at the end of the day.

People who say that higher wages are always passed on to the consumers should ask themselves why employers don't just imagine wages are higher and raise prices anyway. Walmart charges what they charge to be competitive and profitable. It's not like if employees suddenly started making less, then walmart would lower prices even further.

SNOWBALL · #22 04-01-2007, 11:56 PM

Penn and Teller would have been in serious trouble if they interviewed Costco CEO Jim Sinegal, who pays employees more than 40% more than what wal-mart subsidiary sam's club pays. Costco has shown that high wages and low prices can go together just fine.

ojc02 · #23 04-02-2007, 12:09 AM

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I resent that they claim that raising wages and benefits raises prices. That's like saying that when my bonii at absolute poker went down, my WR had to go up. wtf? The prices at walmart are set by market forces, and market forces are a lot more complex than maintaining a certain ROI for walmart.

I realize in a lot of cases, prices do go up to cover higher costs, but this wouldn't necesarrily be on of those cases. A number of things could happen. Walmart could pay more, but end up laying off some of the least useful jobs. They could pay more, make less profit, but still do fine at the end of the day.

People who say that higher wages are always passed on to the consumers should ask themselves why employers don't just imagine wages are higher and raise prices anyway. Walmart charges what they charge to be competitive and profitable. It's not like if employees suddenly started making less, then walmart would lower prices even further.

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Well, margins in retail are RAZOR thin; Walmart achieves their impressive profits by having very low admin costs and by selling a gigantic amount of merchandize. If labor costs go up in any kind of meaningful way, it is definitely going to impact prices on the shelf.

If employees did start making less, Walmart might lower their prices, it depends on the elasticity of demand of their consumers. I honestly don't know if they would or not, it's a tough question to figure out if dropping prices like that would raise their profit.

lehighguy · #24 04-02-2007, 01:03 AM

Unions already use violence and deception to form in many cases. Wal-Mart does the only thing it can to prevent unionization, any store that votes to unionize is shut down immediately. They write the entire investment off as a loss and move on.

lehighguy · #25 04-02-2007, 01:06 AM

We don't even need to go that far. If labor costs get driven down another company will lower their prices to steal Wal Marts business, and Wal Mart will need to respond.

lehighguy · #26 04-02-2007, 01:08 AM

Costco might have a better model, it is hard to tell. If Jim's correct then they will put Wal Mart out of business. In a free market we let these people duke it out to see whose better.

ianlippert · #27 04-02-2007, 05:36 AM

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Well, I think the workers should unionize themselves, using violence if necessary. I don't mind anti-discrimination stuff that is already in place, also.

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Thats fine, then walmart should be able to use violence to defend itself. In the meantime everyone pays the costs of lost production, further reducing the workers standard of living. Not much of a solution.

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And I'm not a socialist, which shows how little you are paying attention

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There's how many people on this board? I dont keep a flow chart of everyones beliefs. I mean if you honestly dont care about figuring out solutions for poor workers then whats the point of coming on this board? Its simply indignant mental masterbation.

SNOWBALL · #28 04-02-2007, 06:00 AM

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I especially enjoy the part where Penn replies to people that are being interviewed via voice over. It's better that was, because I don't like when experts have a chance to respond.

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I don't consider Robert Greenwald to be an expert on anything. I wish they would have interviewed a good left-wing economist from the Economic Policy Institute.

neverforgetlol · #29 04-02-2007, 08:18 AM

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Unions already use violence and deception to form in many cases. Wal-Mart does the only thing it can to prevent unionization, any store that votes to unionize is shut down immediately. They write the entire investment off as a loss and move on.

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Oh yes, the unions using violence and deception.. hahaha

I don't think you understand, employees that even talk about unions are told they will be fired, and are moved to another area of the store. Unions are not the problem here.

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Costco might have a better model, it is hard to tell. If Jim's correct then they will put Wal Mart out of business. In a free market we let these people duke it out to see whose better.

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A free market only exists in theory.

neverforgetlol · #30 04-02-2007, 08:21 AM

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Thats fine, then walmart should be able to use violence to defend itself. In the meantime everyone pays the costs of lost production, further reducing the workers standard of living. Not much of a solution.

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That is absurd. Walmart already uses coercion and violence against it's employees, so that would be nothing new. The whole point of organization would be to prevent these acts, and fight for better working conditions.