"All in?" asked as a question, not a statement - ruling?

[jeffnc]

[ QUOTE ]
In both examples, the words "all in" were spoken. What is the difference between the question "all in?" and the statement "did he say all in?"

[/ QUOTE ]

When you consider that the second phrase was a question also, not a statement, then not much.

[steamboatin]

Just another good reason to speak in complete sentances.

[AngusThermopyle]

[ QUOTE ]
What is the difference between the question "all in?" and the statement "did he say all in?"

[/ QUOTE ]

Maybe the fact that we are dealing with the spoken word, not the written word.
Maybe the fact that the statement "All in." and the question "All in?" are very close in the spoken word, while easily distinguishable in the written word.
Maybe the fact that I can say "All in" as a statement, but change my mind and argue that I was asking a question, and it is next to impossible for the dealer or floor to know the truth.

[Rottersod]

Happy Birthday Angus [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

[QuadsOverQuads]

I'm seeing this angle more and more frequently at my room, too.

"Check?"
"Bet?"
"Raise?"
"Call?"

And then there's the variable-volume version:

"did he CHECK?"
"you RAISE?"
"did she CALL?"

And my personal favorite:

"what-if-I-went ALL IN?"

Another related angle:

* 3/6 game
* flop action is complete
* turn is being brought
* guy with first action calls "six!" as the card is being brought
* dealer takes it as a bet
* after seeing reaction, guy objects: "no, I was just asking for a six!"

Lately, I've seen dealers all over the map on this bullsh*t move, too.


My view : it is the player's responsibility to keep their verbal actions clear and unambiguous, and anything short of that is done completely at the player's risk and should be called aggressively by the dealer (and the floor if necessary).

Unfortunately, proper enforcement on these angle-shots varies greatly from room-to-room (with many rooms ignoring them completely).

</.02>


q/q

[diddyeinstein]

[ QUOTE ]

Maybe the fact that I can say "All in" as a statement, but change my mind and argue that I was asking a question, and it is next to impossible for the dealer or floor to know the truth.

[/ QUOTE ]

I think this is the best reason why it should be treated as a call.

[FireStorm]

OT but if you are angle shooting for 1 BB in live 3/6 Limit, your life is pretty much a joke and you can have either SIXXXXXXXXX you want.

[Yads]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
I say Player B just called.

The only reason I say that is, maybe he'll learn a lesson, and not allow the words "all-in" to come out of his mouth unless he wants to put all his chips in.

Rule this a call, and I'll bet the next time Player B is in this spot, he'll say something like, "Excuse me? I didn't quite hear you. Did you say that you were all-in?", or, "Is the action on me? Did he check or bet?"

[/ QUOTE ]

So it's not a call, but we need to teach this player a lesson, so we're going to rule it a call? Glad I don't have you as a father.

[/ QUOTE ]

And that's why you always leave a note.

[Phntm]

So now we are going to let the floor decide intonation? No way, if you are going to ask a question you have to make some indication. There is no way that anyone can honestly tell the difference between "all-in?" or "all-in". Lets face it half the people in the cardrooms of america wouldn't be able to tell if it was in written form, let alone a tonal thing, don't even get me started about people who can't understand sarcasm.

[youtalkfunny]

[ QUOTE ]
What is the difference between the question "all in?" and the statement "did he say all in?"

[/ QUOTE ]

The second one will never make someone think, "That guy who said those words just moved all-in."

When it's your turn to act, your first words should not be "call, raise, fold, etc" unless that's what you want to do. Everyone at the table is expecting you to announce your action. If you're going to say anything that is NOT your intended action, you should make sure that you don't say something that could be mistakenly interpreted as your intended action.

Or you could keep saying things like "All-in?". You can keep bringing the game to a halt while we argue about what to do, and you can hope that a floorman doesn't rule that you have to push all your chips in when you don't want to.