a hand vs PA, 200/400 HU

[g-p]

krantz said hes "not been hitting any good bluff catchers or found many good spots to slowplay to induce bluffs"

so im guessing he hasn't shoved any turns really thin (which maybe he should consider)

[jlocdog]

"Simple: PA is not a spew monkey bluff tard. U have a bluff catcher by the river, so fold. Only thing he's vbetting is the full house or maybe better flush."

"River:AcTx (as a bluff), x6, TT, 44, QJc+"

"Obv the math against this range makes it a call vs the logic of the hand. But I think u need to call here for metagame."

Hmmmm.....I guess now I must do the obligatory SAALLLAAAAAZZZZZZAAAAAAAAAARRRRRRRRRRR

[catcher193]

vn hand Krantz, ty.

can you remember how high a pocket pair he can possibly flat?

I am just trying to think of the worse hand he could VB with here that would get valuecut, and I'm having trouble, I think if I got to this flop and elected not to 3 bet with a hand like QQ JJ TT, I'd play it the same for value and feel good about myself with probably more of a moderate image.

remember though, you still beat the random straitdraws and total monkeyair.

[gman06]

I really like Ansky's post and agree you should fold. I also think the rest of the hand is played well.

[cowpig]

[ QUOTE ]
I think a flop 3bet is a massive mistake, for a couple reasons. It might be ok if the board was like 742 w/ 2 clubs , but the fact that the board is paired, as well as the fact that we are 80k deep- not 60k or 40k makes 3betting a real big mistake. I doubt you get a fold from bigish hands, and you probably get played back at w/ a lot of bigger draws.


[/ QUOTE ]

My problem with calling is that we haven't done anything to define his range since he basically check-raises everything, and overcards still have a ton of equity. I guess we can shove turn on a blank, but if he checks are we going to fire? I feel like calling is going to result in him showing down A high or something.

[KRANTZ]

[ QUOTE ]
vn hand Krantz, ty.

can you remember how high a pocket pair he can possibly flat?


[/ QUOTE ]

i would think he calls with TT and JJ significantly more frequently than he reraises them this deep. QQ+ and he would reraise.

[Lucky]

I call here for sure. He almost never has the six, and rarely the 4. More importantly, he thinks you never have it, so he bets. call

[Up-grey-de]

[ QUOTE ]
I call here for sure. He almost never has the six, and rarely the 4. More importantly, he thinks you never have it, so he bets. call

[/ QUOTE ]

Why do you think he never has the 6 or 4? Krantz said that he defends way too much...I think his range here is pretty big, so for that reason alone I do not agree with you that this is a insta call, and, since krantz called both the flop and turn bet PA has to put him on a pretty strong hand.

[Pasterbator]

[ QUOTE ]
I call here for sure. He almost never has the six, and rarely the 4. More importantly, he thinks you never have it, so he bets. call

[/ QUOTE ]

He can absolutely have the 6. A 4 is a little weirder, but its possible.

He has to be capable of showing up with KT or something along those lines. I'll be back after class with more thoughts, but i think hes capable of vbetting worse here a fair amount.

With a Khigh flush, this is a much easier call obviously, but i dont think we can fold this to PA.

[Ansky]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
I think a flop 3bet is a massive mistake, for a couple reasons. It might be ok if the board was like 742 w/ 2 clubs , but the fact that the board is paired, as well as the fact that we are 80k deep- not 60k or 40k makes 3betting a real big mistake. I doubt you get a fold from bigish hands, and you probably get played back at w/ a lot of bigger draws.


[/ QUOTE ]

My problem with calling is that we haven't done anything to define his range since he basically check-raises everything, and overcards still have a ton of equity. I guess we can shove turn on a blank, but if he checks are we going to fire? I feel like calling is going to result in him showing down A high or something.

[/ QUOTE ]

So? I'd rather 3bet with total air here. What are you doing if 4 bet?