What did I tell you about cold calling my reraises?

[Pat Southern]

Call down. You'll see AA or KK here a lot but you'll also see worse Js or a bluff too.

[mlagoo]

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also i dont see why he couldnt have AA or KK here.

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most people would be frightened to play one of those hands oop in a 3way pot -- particularly someone who has been playing lag anyway.

[Pat Southern]

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also i dont see why he couldnt have AA or KK here.

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most people would be frightened to play one of those hands oop in a 3way pot -- particularly someone who has been playing lag anyway.

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Good players will also not 4 bet in that spot with AA or KK (AA especially) because they know that it defines their hand pretty well.

[mlagoo]

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also i dont see why he couldnt have AA or KK here.

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most people would be frightened to play one of those hands oop in a 3way pot -- particularly someone who has been playing lag anyway.

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Good players will also not 4 bet in that spot with AA or KK (AA especially) because they know that it defines their hand pretty well.

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well, either that, or theyll 4bet wider. and i would think a 22/18 would be of the variety that would 4bet wider.

[Bakes]

so he's going to be afraid of playing AA/KK oop in a 3way 3bet pot, but he's not going to be afraid of a better hand than a crap jack like QJ here? he's not going to be afraid of bluffing a preflop reraiser by raising the minimum?

something doesn't add up here for me, i think we might have to agree to disagree but i can't for the life of me think of a time where i even saw a c/r minraise bluff in a spot like this. i'd say he is bluffing <5% of the time, more like 1%. i'd say he turns up with a worse jack like 10%, the same jack like 15%, and the rest he has us smoked with JJ+ or even 76s (which fits with the preflop read but i think its kinda unlikely).

[Pat Southern]

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also i dont see why he couldnt have AA or KK here.

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most people would be frightened to play one of those hands oop in a 3way pot -- particularly someone who has been playing lag anyway.

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Good players will also not 4 bet in that spot with AA or KK (AA especially) because they know that it defines their hand pretty well.

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well, either that, or theyll 4bet wider. and i would think a 22/18 would be of the variety that would 4bet wider.

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Sometimes they'll do that, sometimes they'll just call here, what I'm saying is that AA is definately a part of a good player's range here, while JTo probably isn't. It doesn't mean that I thnk its a fold, but its definately something to consider.

Edit: The more I think of it, the more I think that we are beat, but I know that I don't fold this in the heat of the moment, but pretty much every time I call down I get pissed at myself when I see a monster.

[mlagoo]

i agree btw that JTo/QJo isnt in his range, ive never said that they were. however, i do think its possible that our read on him as a "good player" is based on too small a sample size and he's doing this with some small pair or another.

[Bakes]

4 orbits seems like enough time to tell whether he has some clue about what he's doing. he made it to this sat, which seems to have double stacks so i assume its a 300+ buyin. most players who make it to this level, and seem to have some clue know that a min c/r in a 3-bet pot with 88 here is suicide.

[RichC.]

it just dawned on me, BB can make a loose call PF with a wide range if he thinks CO will call too. He may have easily fell in love with his KJs and think that CO might have been stealing, even this early and that our Hero is making a reraise to protect his button with a weaker hand. I know its a bit of a stretch, but I see it all the time. Just something to consider as think we are still ahead here.

[Bakes]

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it just dawned on me, BB can make a loose call PF with a wide range if he thinks CO will call too. He may have easily fell in love with his KJs and think that CO might have been stealing, even this early and that our Hero is making a reraise to protect his button with a weaker hand. I know its a bit of a stretch, but I see it all the time. Just something to consider as think we are still ahead here.

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then might as well throw in random suited 6's like 56s, 76s, etc which all crush us hard.