Animal cruelty and child molestation in AC land

[UATrewqaz]

I know there are about 10 AC threads or so as usual on the front page... I saw there was a "who will help the helpless" thread a few months ago and this kind of fits into that vein.

If these questions have been addressed in depth somewhere previously feel free to lock/delete thread.

How are cases of animal cruelty and child molestation handled in AC land?

If I want to say, dip a bunch of kittens in gasoline and lite them on fire, who am I accountable to? What am I accountable for?

Likewise say I want to sexually molest my young child. To what group or entity do I answer to, if any.

[Nielsio]

Can you think of a voluntary solution?

[LinusKS]

The children and the kittens would need to hire "Private Defense Organizations" (PDO's), who would then contact the rapists' and sadists' PDO's and negotiate for arbitration in front of an Neutral Arbitrator. If the pedophile or sadist didn't show up, it would hurt his credit rating.

[ShakeZula06]

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If I want to say, dip a bunch of kittens in gasoline and lite them on fire, who am I accountable to? What am I accountable for?

Likewise say I want to sexually molest my young child. To what group or entity do I answer to, if any.


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People that want to stand up against animal cruelty and child molestation. You think everyone living around you are just going to throw up their hands and say "oh well"?

[hmkpoker]

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If I want to say, dip a bunch of kittens in gasoline and lite them on fire, who am I accountable to? What am I accountable for?

[/ QUOTE ]

Do you honestly believe that the state does anything significant to prevent this? If I want to torture an animal, believe me, I can do it in the privacy of my own home, legal or not. This is also kind of a pathological question, because seriously, who actually does this?

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Likewise say I want to sexually molest my young child. To what group or entity do I answer to, if any.

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Granted, the child is too young to be responsible for himself. So who should be responsible for him: his parents, or the state? The state can not care for him without assuming some kind of eminent domain over his parents. Yes, there are problems with both conditions. But is giving parental authority to the state really any better?

[Borodog]

It depends on what the culture is. If everyone agrees that such things are bad, then:

a) Insurance companies and security firms will probably not act to defend you or your property from incursion. In the same way that you cannot take out an insurance policy against the chance that you will commit murder, you cannot insure yourself against the chance that you will abuse children and animals.

b) If you file for arbitration against someone who came onto your property and removed the kittens/children and/or physically restrained you from performing such acts (i.e. initiated force against you), the arbitrator would almost certainly not find in your favor, since he has his job because his decisions reflect cultural norms.

Believe it or not there are libertarians who would argue against this; I disagree with them; "rights" are social norms, and if the cultural norm is that animal cruelty and child molestation are "bad", then in rights-jargon you will have estoppled your own right to not be aggressed against. In plainspeak, if you do things that everyone in the community agrees is dispicable, nobody is going to be on your side, including arbitrators.

Of course, (b) will likely be seized upon as some sort of weakness of free market anarchism, or the claim will be made that this constitutes "government", i.e. the majority "forcing" their will on the minority. I disagree completely, of course. I have always said that for free market anarchism to have a chance, the culture must change drastically to once of respect for private property rights and freedom of exchange. This does not in any way imply a need for a culture that respects (or even tolerates) child molestation or animal cruelty (in fact Hoppe's market anarchism has a decidedly conservative, if not preachingly moralistic bent; an area of disagreement I have with him).

[Borodog]

[ QUOTE ]
The children and the kittens would need to hire "Private Defense Organizations" (PDO's), who would then contact the rapists' and sadists' PDO's and negotiate for arbitration in front of an Neutral Arbitrator. If the pedophile or sadist didn't show up, it would hurt his credit rating.

[/ QUOTE ]

Closer than you think. Much more likely though:

3rd parties would intervene to stop the abuse and/or physically remove the children/animals. If the abuser filed for damages against them, he would lose, since nobody is going to side with kiddie rapers and kitty torturers, especially not arbitrators who want their decisions to retain market value in the community. Who would use an arbitrator who sides with child molesters?

He probably would end up with his credit rating hurt, though.

[Case Closed]

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If I want to say, dip a bunch of kittens in gasoline and lite them on fire, who am I accountable to? What am I accountable for?

Likewise say I want to sexually molest my young child. To what group or entity do I answer to, if any.


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People that want to stand up against animal cruelty and child molestation. You think everyone living around you are just going to throw up their hands and say "oh well"?

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Yes I think people will do this. How often do people allow men to beat their wives while the neighbors know about it and do nothing? I would make the assumption that most people naturally don't want to interfere with the business of others.

[JackWhite]

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People that want to stand up against animal cruelty and child molestation. You think everyone living around you are just going to throw up their hands and say "oh well"?


[/ QUOTE ]

What are they going to do? A few days ago a woman in Michigan tried to sell the sexual services of her 7 year old daughter. The state came in, arrested the woman and took her children away. In AC land those children would almost certainly still be with that ungodly horrible mother. Situations like this are why I like the state.

If I am wrong, please tell me the procedure for the immidiate removal of children from an abusive parent in AC land.

[Borodog]

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If I want to say, dip a bunch of kittens in gasoline and lite them on fire, who am I accountable to? What am I accountable for?

Likewise say I want to sexually molest my young child. To what group or entity do I answer to, if any.


[/ QUOTE ]
People that want to stand up against animal cruelty and child molestation. You think everyone living around you are just going to throw up their hands and say "oh well"?

[/ QUOTE ]

Yes I think people will do this. How often do people allow men to beat their wives while the neighbors know about it and do nothing? I would make the assumption that most people naturally don't want to interfere with the business of others.

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You are stuck inside of a box, a particular mode of thinking that relies on a monopolist source of intervention. If your neighbor was beating his wife, what would you do now? Probably call the cops. Just because there would be no monopoly of intervention does not mean there would not be organizations you could contact that would intervene somehow. There are perfectly reasonable market examples of similar organizations, for example animal rescue organizations. In a culture where the norm is that it is ok to incur onto someone's property to stop them from harming another (not all that unual) then the wife-beater will not have a case against the intervening organization, since no reputable arbitrator is going to side with the wife-beater.