SuperFish Returns

[SparkyDog]

I think the flop checkraise is pretty bad. I don't think you're going to move UTG and MP off their hands often enough to justify the semibluff. The board fits a 40/24's floating range pretty much like a glove, and on a board this drawy he'll be calling the turn with hands that aren't showdownable but have a good draw, as opposed to folding those hands on the turn. So we're committing to firing 3 barrels here to fold out those busted draws > T-hi.

However, on those turn and river cards he's not folding any piece of the board or ace-high. Not many cards are going to be scary enough for him to fold, and it'll be hard to tell which ones they are.

I think check/calling the flop, and evaluating the turn and river is a much better line.

[Redd]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Standard IMO.

[/ QUOTE ]

Am I being dysoned here, or are you all serious? I'd basically play every street differently.

[/ QUOTE ]

Did you notice the PFR checked and the late position LAGgy cold-caller bet the flop?

[/ QUOTE ]
Yeah. I don't want to invest this much to try to bluff a LAG with a propensity for cold-calling out of the pot. I'd rather call the flop, c/c turn, c/f riv ui. FWIW, I'd also fold to the LAGTAG's raise pf.

[Caddy_4_Life]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Standard IMO.

[/ QUOTE ]

Am I being dysoned here, or are you all serious? I'd basically play every street differently.

[/ QUOTE ]

I agree. If this is standard, then I must also be a super fish.

Talk about a nice flop for the field.

-Caddy

[Kwaz]

The 9 and the 4 are two of the best cards for you turn/river. The combination (according to villian) means that almost any draw you had on the flop has now at least paired up. He will fold heaps of better unpaired hands on this river. And when villian plays the hand, as he has, I think he holds one of those hands more than 1:8. IMO, there is no other way to play this hand after you c/r the flop.

The only other way to play this hand has already been suggested: c/c, c/c, c/f.

If MP's WtSD stat is <39, I'd c/r the flop.

[Redd]

[ QUOTE ]

The 9 and the 4 are two of the best cards for you turn/river. The combination (according to villian) means that almost any draw you had on the flop has now at least paired up.

[/ QUOTE ]

I don't necessarily agree with this; there's plenty of flush draws (like ours) that haven't paired. But if we were to assume this is the case, then conversely almost any draw that Villain had on the flop has also paired up, and he's probably not the type to let go of a pair HU.

[ILOVEPOKER929]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Standard IMO.

[/ QUOTE ]

Am I being dysoned here, or are you all serious? I'd basically play every street differently.

[/ QUOTE ]

I agree. If this is standard, then I must also be a super fish.

Talk about a nice flop for the field.

-Caddy

[/ QUOTE ]

How would you play this hand every street Caddy? Im not gonna tell you my reasons for my actions until later when I give a result post.

[Saborion]

I'm not sure I like the flop CR. You will not win the pot there and then very often, and if MP has any pair he will call down. Why not just play your draw passively and hope that UTG tags along, giving you better odds? Sure, sometimes MP has 9x, UTG AT and overcalls the flop, only to see the turn bring a T. That won't be the case very often though.

[DavidC]

fold preflop

River bet is good.

I don't think you're folding anyone until the river which is why I check and call the flop.

However, what do you think about donking it instead?

I don't know how often utg will CBF here and how often he'll raise you if you do that. That's two pieces of info that we'd like to have.

--Dave.

[Caddy_4_Life]

Hey ILPoker,

How standard is the pf call for you? I think if you have a good handle on the table and are not 4-10 tabling it's +EV but when I'm multi-tabling I'm throwing away this hand.

I'm having trouble with the flop. I'm going over and over in my head what yields greatest +EV and I just don't think c/r'ing this flop is the ticket. 3-way I can handle, I think 4-way vs. this line up is pushing it into the red zone. MP and SB hold stats that scream flop peelers (their incorrect flop peel for example could cost you the pot because we still have two more streets and we're OOP). These are the types we should encourage to stay around as we draw to our flush. Like I said I don't think you'll get it HU anyways all too often. I know MP could be position betting but this flop is barely co-ordinated enough for me to be uncomfortable with it. Usually when I have a line-up of peelers, a strong draw, and a co-ordinated flop, I don't go into isolation mode and try to take it down immediately because I get stuck with tough turn, river decisions like you did here. I instead go into check/call mode until I hit to benefit from their peeling habits which is money in my pocket everytime I get 2-3 of them to call along.

Give the flop c/r, I think this is a standard continuation bet as we still have our FD draw, you got it HU (Which I assume was your goal?), we picked up a gutshot, and we now have some decent fold equity.

I shrug my shoulders at the river but I don't think we have much choice but to bet. MP is shaping up to have made a hand but we're banking we can make him fold 1 in 9 times. I do think a river bet is +EV.

Overall I'd just be a bit diappointed with the hand as we put 1:1 into this pot from the flop on with MP and we're on a draw that comes in 4:1 by the turn and 4:1 on the river.

So I guess I'm just weighing the the check/raise vs. check/call flop lines and I think I'm leaning towards the check/call.

Back to your pf call, what suited hands do you usually start calling in this position getting 7 to 1? T5s must be borderline for you too..

I look forward to hearing your thoughts on the hand.

-Caddy

[Scary_Tiger]

[ QUOTE ]
How standard is the pf call for you? I think if you have a good handle on the table and are not 4-10 tabling it's +EV but when I'm multi-tabling I'm throwing away this hand.

[/ QUOTE ]

For me it's very standard, even 12-tabling.