The 10xBB push or fold when antes involved

[Jaswarbrick]

Hi everyone, i was wondering that when using a program like SnG Wizard, that if there are antes involved, should this make a difference to when you are considering pushing with 10xBB?

Say when you have 2100 chips when the blinds are 100/200, you shouldn't be pushing without a premium hand because you have more than 10xBB, but when the blinds are 100/200/25 (with an ante of 25), and you have 2100 chips, should you still not push because you have more than 10xBB?

Thanks.

[w33ktight]

Well, yeah. Pushing at 100/200/25 is worth more than 100/200 because when it works you increase your stack by more of a %, and when it doesn't work you risked the same amount.

[Shortcorner]

Kind of simplistic way of looking at it, alot depends on position and calling ranges. ICM will tell you if it's profitable or not, regardless of antes.

As for pushing premium hands, in the scenario you allude to, I think you are losing alot of value by not standard raising with premium holdings.

I agree though, i can be confusing whether or not to push certain hands in the mid section of games. Just trust ICM here.

[jukofyork]

[ QUOTE ]
Say when you have 2100 chips when the blinds are 100/200, you shouldn't be pushing without a premium hand because you have more than 10xBB, but when the blinds are 100/200/25 (with an ante of 25), and you have 2100 chips, should you still not push because you have more than 10xBB?

[/ QUOTE ]
If you choose to make a standard raise instead then the pot on the flop will be slightly larger (because of the antes) meaning that you will be slightly more committed, and hence you should have been more likely to choose pushing over a standard raise in the first place...

Also, I think it's a bad idea to "set in stone" that you are going to not push whenever you have more than 10BBs. Sometimes you might want to push 12-15BB depending on how hard the hand is to play postflop (eg: unexploitable pushes with small PP and Ax hands) and other times you might want to try standard raising AA/KK with 7-8BB vs an unobservant donk...

Rather than setting an arbitrary threshold of 10BB, ask yourself each time: "If I standard raise, then will I be so committed that I will have to put the rest of my chips in whatever the action and on pretty much any flop?". Most often the answer to this is yes when you have ~10BB or less (but not always!).

Juk [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

[Luisgallo]

[ QUOTE ]
Hi everyone, i was wondering that when using a program like SnG Wizard, that if there are antes involved, should this make a difference to when you are considering pushing with 10xBB?

Say when you have 2100 chips when the blinds are 100/200, you shouldn't be pushing without a premium hand because you have more than 10xBB, but when the blinds are 100/200/25 (with an ante of 25), and you have 2100 chips, should you still not push because you have more than 10xBB?

Thanks.

[/ QUOTE ]

Well: 10BB is just a figure we use to draw a line, nobody says is incorrect pushing 11BB or more.

Above all when antes play you should readjust your real number of BB:
just add 2/3 of the antes to BB and now you have what a BB is whort.

I.E.: if there are 5 players with 100/200/25 your true BB is 290 more or less so you push with any stack <3000.

[Bedz]

Why don't "we" use "M" in SNG language?

[Luisgallo]

[ QUOTE ]
Why don't "we" use "M" in SNG language?

[/ QUOTE ]

M is a kind of useless way to make things more complicated!

Playing a STT you will end up being shortstack most of the times therefore your game is push/call/fold and having the number of BB makes things much easier to work out.

Also M can be misleading, if you decide to push with M=4 with 100/200/25 you will push with a much lower stack so you have to increase to M=6...

If you are playing 12 tables you need to have a full picture very quickly and you cannot waste time multiplying and diving!

At least this works for me!