two value bets

[sethypooh21]

Ick to both.

Hand 1, pot was 3b pre, so he's folding any piece like never.

Hand 2, what non pair hand will he ever call with?

[jba]

since when does a pair not c/r the flop in hand 2?

[jstill]

[ QUOTE ]
since when does a pair not c/r the flop in hand 2?

[/ QUOTE ]

they dont sometimes, underpairs that didnt 3bet pre wont occasionally or 5x, i sometimes wouldnt with a pair + fd if i dont think i have fold equity vs anything currently ahead and it maintains my implied odds

even ignoring that point tho that he ll usually cr any pair are we good half the time he calls the river? sure he mite look us up with A3 AT but is that half the time he calls or cr's? seems super thin if not spewey.

edit: we dont beat the wheel draws anymore, i still think even the 2nd hand is more of a bluff trying to move a decent player off a weak pair after we 3barrel if he takes ck call ck call ck fold lines often and doesnt think hero is on the laggish side (which it seems he is) more than a valuebet. I guess villain viewing hero as lag is also an arguement why he mite call with worse As as well as a reason not to bluff bet A hi but decent players with legit taggish numbers (not a lagtag) often arent the type to want to calldown 3 streets oop in these spots with worse hands than AK in my experience.