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#81
11-09-2006, 03:09 PM
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Re: Doyles Fold Of QQ at the 50k Horse Final Table!
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] Just for the hell of it, how many of you guys know the answer to a few questions like these: What exactly did Einstein mean about gravitation bending light - and please show your math. If there are two people that contributed to this thread can do it, and that's all, can we assume not everybody is a as strong at math as those two? Who here understands the DNA helix, and how it was discovered? Again, more than two people here? But, apparantly 60% of you are smart enough to KNOW exactly how Doyle and Chip think - when they are two of the best to ever play poker. Yes, the best in their field. Do you really think you measure up? You guys are amazing. I can't wait to meet you all at the next major tournament's final table - maybe even HORSE. LMFAO Dogmeat [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] [/ QUOTE ] Have you tried ToP or HEPFAP ? It explains it all in there. Seriously. No relativity involved. Really. dog <*}}}}>< [/ QUOTE ] Riding a bike doesn't make you Lance Armstrong Taking a physics class doesn't make you Einstein Trading a few stocks doesn't make you Warren Buffet But you figure reading TOP and HEPFAP makes everybody as good as Doyle and Chip? Cool. And how many bracelets do you have? O'k, how many major tourny's have you won? O'k, ever won a tourny? Do you really think you are as good as these guys, because that's what your post suggests. Why can't you guys admit that every field of endevour has it's "elite," and we aren't in that class? Dogmeat [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 
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#82
11-09-2006, 04:04 PM
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Re: Doyles Fold Of QQ at the 50k Horse Final Table!
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But you figure reading TOP and HEPFAP makes everybody as good as Doyle and Chip? [/ QUOTE ]Wow- who said anything like that? Being able to apply what you read in a book to interpret a real life situation isn't that difficult. Saying so does NOT mean you are better than the players in the hand. You are merely observing how they applied the concepts, often with some amount of awe at their skill. [ QUOTE ] Why can't you guys admit that every field of endevour has it's "elite," and we aren't in that class? [/ QUOTE ]I don't think anyone is saying we are in that class. However, while Doyle's laydown is much better than most of us would do, the hand isn't that difficult to understand from an analysis standpoint. All the bets and the laydown make sense- you don't have to be an "elite" poker player to see that. I would never even think about comparing myself to these players. Saying that I can underestand their play after watching the hand is not comparing myself to them in anyway; certainly it is not saying that I am better than them. Honestly, I am going broke with QQ on this flop every time, even at this table with these opponents. That doesn't mean I can't reason out why Doyle would makethis fold and why it is correct.
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#83
11-09-2006, 05:13 PM
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Re: Doyles Fold Of QQ at the 50k Horse Final Table!
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everyone knows a min raise equals monster. Standard laydown. [/ QUOTE ] Doyle raises UTG, Chip calls in early position. At this point, Chips likely holding are 22-AA, AQ, and AK. Chip miniraises on the low flop with others to act. He also has to either have a set or big pair, or else he is bluffing. I don't like Chip's miniraise. I think he would be better off flat calling or making a larger reraise.
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#84
11-09-2006, 07:23 PM
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Re: Doyles Fold Of QQ at the 50k Horse Final Table!
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] [ QUOTE ] Just for the hell of it, how many of you guys know the answer to a few questions like these: What exactly did Einstein mean about gravitation bending light - and please show your math. If there are two people that contributed to this thread can do it, and that's all, can we assume not everybody is a as strong at math as those two? Who here understands the DNA helix, and how it was discovered? Again, more than two people here? But, apparantly 60% of you are smart enough to KNOW exactly how Doyle and Chip think - when they are two of the best to ever play poker. Yes, the best in their field. Do you really think you measure up? You guys are amazing. I can't wait to meet you all at the next major tournament's final table - maybe even HORSE. LMFAO Dogmeat [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] [/ QUOTE ] Have you tried ToP or HEPFAP ? It explains it all in there. Seriously. No relativity involved. Really. dog <*}}}}>< [/ QUOTE ] Riding a bike doesn't make you Lance Armstrong Taking a physics class doesn't make you Einstein Trading a few stocks doesn't make you Warren Buffet But you figure reading TOP and HEPFAP makes everybody as good as Doyle and Chip? Cool. And how many bracelets do you have? O'k, how many major tourny's have you won? O'k, ever won a tourny? Do you really think you are as good as these guys, because that's what your post suggests. Why can't you guys admit that every field of endevour has it's "elite," and we aren't in that class? Dogmeat [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] [/ QUOTE ] I never said that I was anywhere near that class. And I did not say that reading those books would make one into that caliber of player necessarily. Hell, it took me a week to think about the whole thing before it made sense to me. What I was saying is that the books referenced would say to make that sick laydown. Do I make that laydown? Not in that spot, but I suck at poker. Do I make that minraise with KK? No I prolly push and get called by Singer's set, that's how retarded I am. If I'm Singer I might even call because I have a gutshot with my pair or something donkish as that. So, no way am I saying I'm in that class of player. But then I usually play $5 SNGs and so I suck just a little less than the typical donkey. BTW I did win a SNG last night so there ;p
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#85
11-10-2006, 10:49 AM
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Re: Doyles Fold Of QQ at the 50k Horse Final Table!
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I don't like Chip's miniraise. I think he would be better off flat calling or making a larger reraise. [/ QUOTE ]I think you can't flat call here because of Singer still being in the hand. He might raise and you'll have no idea where you are, whereas if you raise and he calls you can slow down, and if he re-raises you can probably fold. I don't know about the min raise, but if he raises more it is going to be harder to not double Singer up if Singer hit his set. I don't know that a raise of a higher amount accomplishes anything more than the min raise does in this once instance. Chip is WA/WB here, so it's not like he's offering good odds to any drawing hands by raising the minimum.
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#86
11-10-2006, 12:54 PM
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Re: Doyles Fold Of QQ at the 50k Horse Final Table!
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] But you figure reading TOP and HEPFAP makes everybody as good as Doyle and Chip? [/ QUOTE ]Wow- who said anything like that? Being able to apply what you read in a book to interpret a real life situation isn't that difficult. Saying so does NOT mean you are better than the players in the hand. You are merely observing how they applied the concepts, often with some amount of awe at their skill. [ QUOTE ] Why can't you guys admit that every field of endevour has it's "elite," and we aren't in that class? [/ QUOTE ]I don't think anyone is saying we are in that class. However, while Doyle's laydown is much better than most of us would do, the hand isn't that difficult to understand from an analysis standpoint. All the bets and the laydown make sense- you don't have to be an "elite" poker player to see that. I would never even think about comparing myself to these players. Saying that I can underestand their play after watching the hand is not comparing myself to them in anyway; certainly it is not saying that I am better than them. Honestly, I am going broke with QQ on this flop every time, even at this table with these opponents. That doesn't mean I can't reason out why Doyle would makethis fold and why it is correct. [/ QUOTE ] I don't understand why this is such a huge laydown. Metagame counts here guys. Against a random player, most people Doyle including are going broke. But Doyle and Chip have played against each other for over 20 years. I think we have all made laydowns like that against our closest poker buddies knowing we are beat. It's basically the same thing, it just happens to be in a $50,000 HORSE tourniment.
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#87
11-15-2006, 02:36 AM
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Re: Doyles Fold Of QQ at the 50k Horse Final Table!
[ QUOTE ]
Just for the hell of it, how many of you guys know the answer to a few questions like these: What exactly did Einstein mean about gravitation bending light - and please show your math. If there are two people that contributed to this thread can do it, and that's all, can we assume not everybody is a as strong at math as those two? Who here understands the DNA helix, and how it was discovered? Again, more than two people here? But, apparantly 60% of you are smart enough to KNOW exactly how Doyle and Chip think - when they are two of the best to ever play poker. Yes, the best in their field. Do you really think you measure up? You guys are amazing. I can't wait to meet you all at the next major tournament's final table - maybe even HORSE. LMFAO Dogmeat [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] [/ QUOTE ] If you posed the first question on a reasonable physics forum and the second on a biology forum, I would bet quite a few people could answer them. Seeing as how this is a poker forum... Understanding a theory is quite different from developing it, and analyzing someone's actions is different from being able to perform at their level.
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#88
11-15-2006, 01:47 PM
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Re: Doyles Fold Of QQ at the 50k Horse Final Table!
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] everyone knows a min raise equals monster. Standard laydown. [/ QUOTE ] Doyle raises UTG, Chip calls in early position. At this point, Chips likely holding are 22-AA, AQ, and AK. Chip miniraises on the low flop with others to act. He also has to either have a set or big pair, or else he is bluffing. I don't like Chip's miniraise. I think he would be better off flat calling or making a larger reraise. [/ QUOTE ] I don't like a flat call either. If Singer raises, what do you put him on? If Doyle or David have a smaller pair - you give them another opportunity to make their set. It's unlikely Doyle has made a set by his action, so if your minraise puts David out, and Doyle calls then you are hu & in excellent position to get all your chips in on the turn.
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#89
11-21-2006, 03:27 PM
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Re: Doyles Fold Of QQ at the 50k Horse Final Table!
Some of you guys are way too quick to say this was collusion. That is a very serious allegation that should not be thrown around lightly.
Also, if they was collusion or soft play going on then why did Chip try to trap him preflop? It doesn't make sense. Doyle would have lost less chips if Chip raised... or maybe you guys are trying to say Doyle was doing a really good job of dumping chips to Chip in an elaborate plan with QQ vs KK? He made a great lay down... give him some credit for it and stop being such haters
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