$25: A summary of newbie ness

NL Newbie · #1 10-12-2006, 04:10 PM

I cant believe how badly i played some these, mix of tilt and weak tight play. NL$25 seems very different to NL$10(More aggro and wierd bluffers and generally confusing play).

Anyhow on with the show [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img] Please review/post.

PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em, $0.25 BB (6 handed) Hand History Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com (Format: 2+2 Forums)

CO ($16.25)
Button ($32.35)
SB ($16.10)
Hero ($15)
UTG ($18.60)
MP ($16.95)

Preflop: Hero is BB with A[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], A[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img].
UTG calls $0.25, 3 folds, SB completes, Hero raises to $1, UTG calls $0.75, SB calls $0.75.

Flop: ($3) J[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], T[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], Q[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (3 players)
SB checks, Hero bets $2.25, UTG raises to $4.5, SB folds, Hero folds.

Final Pot: $9.75

 Such a crap flop, i think i overated my opponent. I thought he wont raise one pair here because i raised preflop and surely he knows i probably hit this flop hence the bet.... So i put him on 2pair and calling the turn to re-evaluate seems spewy as he'll only bet again then what do i do? 

PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em, $0.25 BB (6 handed) Hand History Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com (Format: 2+2 Forums)

UTG ($16.75)
MP ($29.15)
CO ($17.10)
Hero ($13.05)
SB ($18.95)
BB ($16.05)

Preflop: Hero is Button with A[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], K[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img].
1 fold, MP raises to $1, 1 fold, Hero raises to $2.5, 2 folds, MP raises to $29.15, Hero folds.

Final Pot: $32

 wow i hate reraising AK vs deepish stacks. WTF do you do when they push? Fold im sure of it. Why the hell am i reraising if i fold to a push GRRRRR AQ prob folds and AA/KK push. Hell QQ may push and if not im prob folding a crap flop, can you tell im in a tilting mindset? [img]/images/graemlins/confused.gif[/img] 

PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em, $0.25 BB (6 handed) Hand History Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com (Format: 2+2 Forums)

Hero ($22.15)
UTG ($17.95)
MP ($30.40)
CO ($6.85)
Button ($55.30)
SB ($19.15)

Preflop: Hero is BB with Q[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], Q[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img].
UTG calls $0.25, MP raises to $1, 2 folds, SB calls $0.90, Hero calls $0.75, UTG calls $0.75.

Flop: ($4) 9[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], 2[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], 7[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (4 players)
SB bets $0.5, Hero raises to $3, UTG folds, MP folds, SB calls $2.50.

Turn: ($10) 3[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (2 players)
SB checks, Hero checks.

River: ($10) J[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (2 players)
SB checks, Hero bets $4, SB calls $4.

Final Pot: $18

 Me being weak tight, once again i got MUBS and thought "WTF? he called a huge raise whats he got. so i checked the turn for "pot control" then value bet river. I should bet turn though and maybe check behind river if hes not a calling station donkey yeh? 

PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em, $0.25 BB (6 handed) Hand History Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com (Format: 2+2 Forums)

Hero ($23.20)
UTG ($15.75)
MP ($16.65)
CO ($18.15)
Button ($9.30)
SB ($14.30)

Preflop: Hero is BB with A[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], K[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img].
UTG calls $0.25, MP calls $0.25, CO calls $0.25, 1 fold, SB completes, Hero raises to $1.5, UTG folds, MP folds, CO folds, SB calls $1.25.

Flop: ($3.75) 2[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], 2[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], 9[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (2 players)
SB bets $1, Hero calls $1.

Turn: ($5.75) 3[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (2 players)
SB bets $1, Hero calls $1.

River: ($7.75) 8[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (2 players)
SB bets $10.8 (All-In), Hero folds.

Final Pot: $18.55

 Uh i hate donk bets when i miss with OC's. He's got a 9, 2 or PP. Im guessing my outs are fairly good so i make a loose-ish call. Same with turn, do you guys ever just give up on this flop? 

PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em, $0.25 BB (6 handed) Hand History Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com (Format: 2+2 Forums)

Hero ($19.60)
SB ($15.25)
BB ($22.15)
UTG ($17.90)
MP ($3.30)
CO ($18.20)

Preflop: Hero is Button with A[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], K[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img].
UTG calls $0.25, MP raises to $1, CO calls $1, Hero raises to $2.75, 1 fold, BB calls $2.50, UTG folds, MP calls $1.75, CO folds.

Flop: ($9.60) 9[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], 2[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], 2[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (3 players)
BB bets $1.5, MP calls $0.55 (All-In), Hero calls $1.50.

Turn: ($13.15) T[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (3 players, 1 all-in)
BB bets $2, Hero calls $2.

River: ($17.15) Q[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (3 players, 1 all-in)
BB bets $3, Hero folds.

Final Pot: $20.15

Seem fine? 

PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em, $0.25 BB (5 handed) Hand History Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com (Format: 2+2 Forums)

Hero ($16.85)
UTG ($13.15)
MP ($8.60)
Button ($20.75)
SB ($12.45)

Preflop: Hero is BB with J[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], K[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img].
UTG calls $0.25, 1 fold, Button calls $0.25, SB completes, Hero checks.

Flop: ($1) 4[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], K[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], 5[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (4 players)
SB checks, Hero bets $0.75, UTG calls $0.75, Button folds, SB folds.

Turn: ($2.50) 2[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (2 players)
Hero bets $2, UTG calls $2.

River: ($6.50) Q[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (2 players)
Hero bets $4, UTG raises to $10.15, Hero calls ?

Another crap hand, just like with the 922 flop where the guy calls me down. WTF is this guy got? On the turn i thought a set, but i though "hmm prob junk actually, like everyone else" so i value bet. River i value bet then he pushes, its like $20:$6 to call, so 3:1 roughly - Do we fold? 

PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em, $0.25 BB (6 handed) Hand History Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com (Format: 2+2 Forums)

Hero ($22.15)
UTG ($17.95)
MP ($30.40)
CO ($6.85)
Button ($55.30)
SB ($19.15)

Preflop: Hero is BB with Q[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], Q[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img].
UTG calls $0.25, MP raises to $1, 2 folds, SB calls $0.90, Hero calls $0.75, UTG calls $0.75.

Flop: ($4) 9[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], 2[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], 7[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (4 players)
SB bets $0.5, Hero raises to $3, UTG folds, MP folds, SB calls $2.50.

Turn: ($10) 3[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (2 players)
SB checks, Hero checks.

River: ($10) J[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (2 players)
SB checks, Hero bets $4, SB calls $4.

Final Pot: $18

Preflop i just called, i dont want to face a push from these people nor do i want to be OOP in bloated pot w/QQ on a XXK or XXA flop.

CHK turn as im thinking a set, he checks river so value bet. Should bet turn right? [img]/images/graemlins/mad.gif[/img]

kurto · #2 10-12-2006, 04:47 PM

Too many hands in one post. You can't get a decent discussion going when they're all together.

Let me say with most of these... having reads would help.

Hand 1- Folding is premature... people will raise you with one pair as well as with flush or straight draws.

Hand 2- I don't think you should shy from reraising AK shorthanded. I will normally fold AK to a push unless the guy is a maniac/superaggressive.... then put your seatbelt on and ride the crazy variance train and hope you run good.

Hand 3 - Shorthanded I'd reraise that PF. As played- Unless I have a read that a guy bets wussy bets with monsters, I'd feel confident that you're ahead. I'd bet the turn too against this guy.

Hand 4- I hate it. Either raise the flop or fold. He either has a small PP or he hit... you don't have odds to call with overcards.

Hand 5- Jeez... you're at a table of calling stations. If you are always raising and everyone's calling... and you want to isolate, you need to raise more. You raised it to $2.75 when there's already over $2 in the pot. Either make a real raise (raise that up to at least $5) or smoothcall.

Regarding flop- they're certainly giving you odds to call with anything. These players are weak betters. I guess you gotta call.

Note- you should be cleaning up at these tables. They're calling stations and give you odds to make your draws. (assuming you hit some draws here or there)

Hand 6: again.. what are your reads? It sure seems like you're beat. But I have no idea how this guy plays. Unless he's bluffing all the time, he's got you beat.

The last hand you already posted.

NL Newbie · #3 10-12-2006, 04:55 PM

Cheers kurto, yeh i realised to many but id hate to make 8 posts and figured someone would do the deed. Much appreciated, my mind clouds over when i take beats and i flip between a 2p2 TAG to a weaktight MUBS player.

Unfortunatly i ended up betting when i was behind and checking behind when i was ahead, not to mention paying off the set with KJ hand(44).

Coming back to the AA hand though, what are you doing? Pushing or calling, if you call what you doing on the turn?

KQ and other hands may make that play, but i figure alot of time im VS 2pair.

holdme · #4 10-12-2006, 05:22 PM

I won't reply to them all as kurto did a pretty nice job already, but

Hand 3: That flop raise is not big as you said it was. It's a 1/2 psb. You should put more out there and bet the proceding streets.

Hand 4: I usually raise that weaksause. You're A and K are often outs anyway.

Hand 6: I'll often c/c river and let a busted draw bet. I'd fold to the raise unless he's bluffy.

kurto · #5 10-12-2006, 05:32 PM

Hey.

Another note-- I hate all these medium stacks. You should always cover everyone.

The AA hand is probably the most difficult because the board is so coordinated. I'm probably calling the reraise against looser players and consider folding against supertight nitty players. If I call, And there's a king or I get a flush draw... I'm still in it.

I have to say I make so many decisions based on how I perceive someone has been playing. Honestly I could push or fold all depending on how the other guy has been playing.

Regarding the KJ vs set of 4s - I really think that's the most obvious one that you're behind. If I remember, the flop was pretty drawless. The guy has to give you credit for at least a pair. He's raising for value their. Your pair is no good.

NL Newbie · #6 10-12-2006, 05:55 PM

[ QUOTE ]
Hey.

Another note-- I hate all these medium stacks. You should always cover everyone.

The AA hand is probably the most difficult because the board is so coordinated. I'm probably calling the reraise against looser players and consider folding against supertight nitty players. If I call, And there's a king or I get a flush draw... I'm still in it.

I have to say I make so many decisions based on how I perceive someone has been playing. Honestly I could push or fold all depending on how the other guy has been playing.

Regarding the KJ vs set of 4s - I really think that's the most obvious one that you're behind. If I remember, the flop was pretty drawless. The guy has to give you credit for at least a pair. He's raising for value their. Your pair is no good.

[/ QUOTE ]

Yeh i agree, it'd take me hours to get reads for all hands its safe to asume most of the players sucked.

The KJ hand was horrible play by me and the AA definatly the toughest, the others i was considering deleting in this post tbh they're not exactly rocket science.

i got MUBS on some, fortunatly the players let me off cheaply [img]/images/graemlins/laugh.gif[/img]

My head clouds over when i take a few beats or play badly and i go back to square one as if ive never played holdem before [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img] [img]/images/graemlins/frown.gif[/img] [img]/images/graemlins/blush.gif[/img]

ymu · #7 10-12-2006, 09:09 PM

[ QUOTE ]
Yeh i agree, it'd take me hours to get reads for all hands its safe to asume most of the players sucked.

[/ QUOTE ]
It doesn't take that long to get reads if you're paying attention. It's fairly safe to assume that they all suck, but what you really need to know is exactly how they suck - eg do they overplay weak hands, slowplay when they shouldn't, pay too much to draw, fold too easily, bluff too much, plus how's their betsizing and what does it mean.

On the AA hand, I wouldn't usually fold this. There's not that many hands I'm worried about and I have a decent draw against some of them. A lot depends on reads (ie his calling range and what he makes a minraise on the flop with) and also your table image - if you're perceived as bluffing a lot of c-bets and folding to minimal heat and so on - and your history with this particular player. Some players I'd reraise, others I'd call and reevaluate the turn. I'm almost never folding this to a minraise when I only bet out 2/3 pot to start with.

Board: Jh Th Qs
Dead:

equity (%) win (%) tie (%)
Hand 1: 43.2506 % 40.37% 02.88% { AdAh }
Hand 2: 56.7494 % 53.87% 02.88% { KK-TT, AQs+, QJs, JTs, AQo+, QJo, JTo }

NL Newbie · #8 10-13-2006, 05:09 AM

[ QUOTE ]
Yeh i agree, it'd take me hours to get reads for all hands its safe to asume most of the players sucked.
It doesn't take that long to get reads if you're paying
[ QUOTE ]
attention. It's fairly safe to assume that they all suck, but what you really need to know is exactly how they suck - eg do they overplay weak hands, slowplay when they shouldn't, pay too much to draw, fold too easily, bluff too much, plus how's their betsizing and what does it mean.

[/qoute]

[/ QUOTE ]
Sorry should of been clearer, i usually have reads on most of my opponents. However i ment it'd take me hours to type them all out and hunt my PTDB for stats aswell as trying to remember the general dynamics of the table.

[ QUOTE ]

On the AA hand, I wouldn't usually fold this. There's not that many hands I'm worried about and I have a decent draw against some of them. A lot depends on reads (ie his calling range and what he makes a minraise on the flop with) and also your table image - if you're perceived as bluffing a lot of c-bets and folding to minimal heat and so on - and your history with this particular player. Some players I'd reraise, others I'd call and reevaluate the turn. I'm almost never folding this to a minraise when I only bet out 2/3 pot to start with.

Board: Jh Th Qs
Dead:

equity (%) win (%) tie (%)
Hand 1: 43.2506 % 40.37% 02.88% { AdAh }
Hand 2: 56.7494 % 53.87% 02.88% { KK-TT, AQs+, QJs, JTs, AQo+, QJo, JTo }

[/ QUOTE ]

[/ QUOTE ]
You dont fold but PS says we're 56/43? I believe this hand has huge reverse implied odds, you disagree?

ymu · #9 10-13-2006, 05:31 AM

[ QUOTE ]
You dont fold but PS says we're 56/43? I believe this hand has huge reverse implied odds, you disagree?

[/ QUOTE ]
Given your stack size there's enough in the pot already to make a push +EV.

Hero ($15)
UTG ($18.60)

Flop: ($3) J, T, Q (3 players)
SB checks, Hero bets $2.25, UTG raises to $4.5, SB folds, Hero folds.

You have $11.75 behind - pushing would give you 43% of a £31 pot, leaving you only slightly down on where you were at the start of the hand if you completely ignore fold equity - with FE it leaves you in profit for the hand. Folding is a loss of $3.25.

The poker stove analysis includes every worst case scenario - most of which wouldn't be minraising this flop (unless villain is really really bad). Sets, two pair and straights should be raising to at least 8 or so. This looks a lot more like a draw or AT-AQ/99.

Push.

KdB · #10 10-13-2006, 06:29 AM

Just one thing:
" Uh i hate donk bets when i miss with OC's. He's got a 9, 2 or PP"
Reraise those tiny donkbets, this pot is ours and if they want to have it they got to pay for it. 99% of the time they give up immediatly.