I did the math for you. Pokerstars Rakeback

[Uniqueuponhim]

Sorry, I wasn't clear in that last comment I made. That statement was in reference to games where the rake would typically exceed $2 on every hand. In that case, most hands would likely have $3 of rake, which would drop my numbers by about 1/3. However, in a 9-handed game the rake is divided among 9 people instead of 6, increasing the number of FPP/$ back to what I had originally calculated. Please correct me if I'm wrong.

[MicroBob]

If I'm understanding you correctly...
yes, on a game where the rake is going to typically max-out on pretty much every raked-hand your effective RB% will be better with 9 players instead of 6.

This increased RB percentage along isn't enough to justify playing in those game however. The amount you make from that extra RB shouldn't be enough to make up for a potentially better game at 6-max.

IOW - at those stakes you should just be chasing the better games and not marginal increases in RB.

At other stakes there is some validity to the idea of preferring full-ring over 6-max for better RB% assuming you are really trying to crank out the points.
But that just means that doing so for your FPP accrual is not a terrible idea...doesn't mean that the 6-max players are making any kind of significant RB error or anything like that or are really losing out on THAT much.

[goofyballer]

I'm pretty sure there's entirely too much bad math in this thread, because I calculated this around 1 yr ago for 1/2 NL 6-max in SSNL using another 2+2er's data and Supernova was like 25% rb.

Assuming anyone wants to properly calculate it, do it like this:
- In PT, for a specific game level (MGR per hand will be different between different stakes and 6-max/non-6-max/HU so don't even bother), grab # of hands and MGR over that sample (MGR is in game notes)
- Figure out # of FPPs earned over that sample; you may have to do this manually, I don't play on Stars but if they do, like, 1 FPP for every hand over XX rake then you can filter out hands below XX rake in game notes and calculate how many FPPs you earned that way
- Figure out the $$ per FPP exchange rate (i.e. if you can trade 1000 FPPs for a $500 tournament entry (lol we wish) that's $0.50 per FPP)
- Take (FPPs / # hands) * ($$ per FPPs) / (MGR / # of hands)

Resulting number should be a decimal. Multiply by 100 and that's your rakeback percentage.

[MicroBob]

[ QUOTE ]

I'm pretty sure there's entirely too much bad math in this thread, because I calculated this around 1 yr ago for 1/2 NL 6-max in SSNL using another 2+2er's data and Supernova was like 25% rb.

[/ QUOTE ]


Note that even this wouldn't be entirely accurate either as I assume you are just looking at FPP value.
if you choose to play the freerolls or if you play enough to make it to the 200k or 300k milestones because there is some extra value there.

It also can vary some on 6-max NL depending on playing-style and table-selection.
And I think this can be more exaggerated at NL then limit.
If you limp-along or cold-call a ton instead of always folding/re-raising then I would think that would lead to a lot more points. Although I'm hardly advocating playing a -EV style just to get a few more points.
Just saying that the RB% could bounce around some from player to player based on these things.

although for most TAG-type players from the SSNL forum I suspect the RB% will be pretty consistent.

[goofyballer]

That's also true of rakeback on any other site fwiw - the percentage will stay constant of course, but some players' styles will generate different amounts of MGR than others. I don't think the effect is that big though.

Also, you can include the value of freerolls or milestones or whatever in your FPP/hand numbers. If you expect to make X FPPs this year and you're going to play in 12 freerolls with $Y EV, then your $ per FPP figure increases by 12Y/X. If you expect to hit suchandsuch bonus, it goes up by $bonus/X.

[steel108]

Why worry about all this. Just log in good quality hands and the rest will take care of itself. Instead of taking the time to do all this, you could have played and made money. Am I the only one who thinks this way?

[PartysOver]

[ QUOTE ]
Why worry about all this. Just log in good quality hands and the rest will take care of itself. Instead of taking the time to do all this, you could have played and made money. Am I the only one who thinks this way?

[/ QUOTE ]

what if your effective rakeback at stars is 15%? you're burning 12% of rakeback over the course of a year... the reason to do this is to make more money

[goofyballer]

[ QUOTE ]
Why worry about all this. Just log in good quality hands and the rest will take care of itself. Instead of taking the time to do all this, you could have played and made money. Am I the only one who thinks this way?

[/ QUOTE ]

1. Could probably say "gee, how much $$ would I have made playing poker instead of doing _____" about most things in my life
2. Obviously properly calculating this can help you figure out if you'll make more money on one site versus another which IS helpful

[ImsaKidd]

The Milestones add a good amount for people who get a lot of fpps (obv).

For example, if you earn 300k VPPs in a year (assuming you are nova the whole year, carryover or w/e), thats 1.05 mil FPPs = roughly 17k in fpps.

The 2 milestones you earn give you $3500 in value (accounting for the fpps used to buy them), so thats 20% of what you got in RB. If nova is normally 30ish %, this makes it 36.

[JimmyRare]

If I am not wrong, I think PokerStars has lower rake than other sites, so this will obviously compense for lower rakeback, right?