30/60 limit holdem full tilt

[ParaMotor]

Is check raising the flop and folding to a bet on the turn ever correct?

Dealt to Hero [5d 9d]
Saybye2URchips folds
Jacksplay: ty
Jacksplay folds
TightTiger raises to $60
greasyjo folds
Hero calls $30
*** FLOP *** [7s 5s As]
Jacksplay: how ya been?
Hero checks
TightTiger bets $30
CityBear (Observer): good and you?
Hero raises to $60
TightTiger calls $30
*** TURN *** [7s 5s As] [3h]
Hero checks
Jacksplay: yeah its been a good weekend
TightTiger bets $60
Hero folds

[teddyFBI]

terrible line.

you are not folding out anything except no pair-nospade.
You put more money in when nearly certainly behind, and gather exactly zero info about your opponent's holding, not to mention you're OOP on all future streets.

Either fold preflop (depending on read), or just C/F flop.

[cdlarmore]

fold preflop, and fold flop unless u think he is a monster lag and u have a ridiculous read that i dont know about in which you can try to bet bet check, fold to any aggression.

In your spot, the way you played it, you have to lead turn, if u dont, i think u have to peel one at least. Folding 5 9 preflop gets rid of these tough postflop connundrums.

[Victor]

hmm, i think its a peel.

"and fold flop unless u think he is a monster lag "

actually, i think its much better to continue against a reasonable player.

[cdlarmore]

On the flop, if he is a reasonable player, we are beat here if we pull the CR and he calls like he did [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]
Why are we thinking it would be a better play against a reasonable player to rip into a flop like this? Also, an unreasonable players range of raising hands that miss this flop are huuuge.....
cdl

[Victor]

huh, i never advocating raising.

[siegfriedandroy]

[ QUOTE ]
terrible line.

you are not folding out anything except no pair-nospade.
You put more money in when nearly certainly behind, and gather exactly zero info about your opponent's holding, not to mention you're OOP on all future streets.

Either fold preflop (depending on read), or just C/F flop.

[/ QUOTE ]

hey teddy. you seem to be a pretty good player. curious about your analysis here:

1) What types of players make you more inclined to fold this preflop? Those with low 'att to steal's? What else? Curious cuz lately ive loosened up a bit from the bb (used to be low 50's, now mid 40's), and would now almost always call w/ this hand v. a steal. What is the biggest factor that would deter you from defending here?

2) As for the flop c'r, is it really that horrible, especially if villain will give up fairly easy? If he steals often, his range would be wide, and would not be almost 'certainly behind'. You are risking 60 to win 150- seems at least possible to me that he will fold often enough, no?

[thiamide]

> Is check raising the flop and folding to a bet on the
> turn ever correct?

Actually, I like your check-raise, but why in the world would you check the turn after check-raising the flop? That is weak. You have to follow through and bet the turn here, otherwise, don't make the check-raise on the flop. More comments below.

> Dealt to Hero [5d 9d]
>
> TightTiger raises to $60

This is a 4-handed game, and the button raised. The button's range is huge here, from a real hand to complete trash on a total steal. Still, you could dump this hand right here and be done with it, which is a fine play.

> *** FLOP *** [7s 5s As]
> Hero checks
> TightTiger bets $30
> Hero raises to $60

I like this check-raise. Your opponent is going to bet that flop no matter what his hole cards are, so his bet is hardly ominous. By no means does your opponent have to have an Ace or a spade. A raise here may take down the pot. Hell, you may even have the best hand.

> TightTiger calls $30

You would have preferred a fold, obviously. He may have some piece of the flop, or perhaps a draw. If he has a marginal hand, he's going to have a tough time sticking around with that type of board -- if you keep the heat on by leading at the turn.

> *** TURN *** [7s 5s As] [3h]
> Hero checks

After making the flop check-raise, you are obligated to bet again here. If you get raised, easy fold. If you get called again, you are likely done with the hand (check the river, and hope he checks behind...if he bets, you can fold). But you need to take one more shot here.

[thiamide]

Whoa, is this a shorthanded game? I assumed it was (I thought I was in the shorthanded forum!) Given the aggressive tempo of shorthanded games, I like the check-raise. If this is a full ring game and the button is not a LAG, I might revise my comments.

[Zobags]

I think this is one of those hands where your equity dramatically changes on the turn, depending on whether is a broadway/spade. For that reason, I would check-call the flop and lead any non-spade turn.