Big pot OOP deep

[corsakh]

Villain is sickmyduck on ipoker. Hes all right. 18/12/3, pretty solid. Positionally aware. Little weak. Straightforward. He called my 3bets a few times, I suspect JJ and AK types of hands. Does not get out of line. I run good at 19/17 and do not get out of line either - plenty of fish at the table.

iPoker
6 handed
50NL

CO $10
Hero in SB $150
Villain in BB $150

Anyway. Fold, fold. Fishy limps. I complete with 77 (was busy on other tables), Viallin raises to $2.5.

Ok, he is tight in the blinds. Very tight. I think 88 is the worst hand he raises here. I dont think he raise AJ. Maybe AQ, but I dont know. He seems to avoid pots with me recently and does not seem to be willing to play big pots even though he has position. Definetly not a steal, I think its safe to put him on a big hand here, TT+, AK type.

Fish calls. I call.

I dont want to be 3betting OOP after I completed either [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

Flop comes 689r.
Ok. Whats the plan [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

Hero checks. Villain pots. Fish call all in (he had pot bet left).

I am positive he has a big pair. Pot is $23. $7.5 to call.

[ama0330]

This advice comes from the MSNL'er I am currently sitting next to.

You should raise this flop because you are deep and he has to fold most of his betting range (overpairs etc) to your raise. All the decisions are close in EV (raise call fold) but raising gives you the best chance to take it down.

If you were 100bb deep this would NOT be a good idea but theres almost no way that this guy is going to call you off with an overpair so deep.

[hoyasaxa]

[ QUOTE ]
This advice comes from the MSNL'er I am currently sitting next to.

You should raise this flop because you are deep and he has to fold most of his betting range (overpairs etc) to your raise. All the decisions are close in EV (raise call fold) but raising gives you the best chance to take it down.

If you were 100bb deep this would NOT be a good idea but theres almost no way that this guy is going to call you off with an overpair so deep.

[/ QUOTE ]

The problem is this is not msnl. You have to be really, really sure he isnt going to stack off with an overpair, which is pretty common at 50nl. I would be much happier just calling, as you'll probably see the river for free with fishy all in.

[Daniel LeClaire]

[ QUOTE ]
This advice comes from the MSNL'er I am currently sitting next to.

You should raise this flop because you are deep and he has to fold most of his betting range (overpairs etc) to your raise. All the decisions are close in EV (raise call fold) but raising gives you the best chance to take it down.

If you were 100bb deep this would NOT be a good idea but theres almost no way that this guy is going to call you off with an overpair so deep.

[/ QUOTE ]

You can close this thread now, because this is the correct answer.

[thac]

Raising to create fold equity against BB's obvious overpair isn't so bad. Pot is 7.5 preflop and 22.5 after fish's call allin, raising to like 35 puts him in a [censored] spot because he has to put us on exactly 77, 76, or 78 to continue in the hand. If he calls/shoves, we have 40% equity against an overpair that is not TT so we gladly take our chances at a huge pot, but in general it should freeze him up some.

The only problem comes on the turn if villain just calls and there's ~80 in the pot with 120 left.

[KEW]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
This advice comes from the MSNL'er I am currently sitting next to.

You should raise this flop because you are deep and he has to fold most of his betting range (overpairs etc) to your raise. All the decisions are close in EV (raise call fold) but raising gives you the best chance to take it down.

If you were 100bb deep this would NOT be a good idea but theres almost no way that this guy is going to call you off with an overpair so deep.

[/ QUOTE ]

You can close this thread now, because this is the correct answer.

[/ QUOTE ]

Not so fast this is the MICROS not msnl and most villains(absent a read) are not capable of folding an overpair..While I do like the advice, at the micros it's is very villain dependant...

[thac]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
This advice comes from the MSNL'er I am currently sitting next to.

You should raise this flop because you are deep and he has to fold most of his betting range (overpairs etc) to your raise. All the decisions are close in EV (raise call fold) but raising gives you the best chance to take it down.

If you were 100bb deep this would NOT be a good idea but theres almost no way that this guy is going to call you off with an overpair so deep.

[/ QUOTE ]

You can close this thread now, because this is the correct answer.

[/ QUOTE ]

Not so fast this is the MICROS not msnl and most villains(absent a read) are not capable of folding an overpair..While I do like the advice, at the micros it's is very villain dependant...

[/ QUOTE ]

But we don't care if he calls or raises sometime, as long as he folds a small amount of time, we break even. We have 10 outs to the effective nuts against this guy, and if we just call and the turn is a 10, we get like no more money in the pot. I'd take a 40/60 with all the money that's in the pot now - if he shoves, make a note of how he never folds an overpair and move on.

[Dallas Dru]

[ QUOTE ]
But we don't care if he calls or raises sometime, as long as he folds a small amount of time, we break even. We have 10 outs to the effective nuts against this guy, and if we just call and the turn is a 10, we get like no more money in the pot. I'd take a 40/60 with all the money that's in the pot now - if he shoves, make a note of how he never folds an overpair and move on.[ QUOTE ]


this is right on

[ama0330]

thac is right in that the main reason we raise is to induce a fold. we do have outs to the nuts but it is unlikely that any more money goes in if the straight hits. the prime reason for this move is for villain to fold most of his betting range.

[Pokey]

Well, let's think about this.

Our folding equity against the fish is zero. Given that he CRAI'ed the flop we can assume we're behind, but we've probably got 8-10 outs to win. So: the pot is offering us 3-to-1 odds right now on a draw that's 4-to-1 to hit on the turn and even better by the river, with some implied odds thrown in for good measure.

I don't like a raise. What does it really accomplish? We isolate against a player who can't fold and who usually has us beaten unless we hit. If we've got to hit to win, why not keep BB around for a potential bigger score when we do hit? If we raise and get called we're definitely behind, and that means our bet gained us 1-to-1 odds on a 4-to-1 draw. Oh, and we'll still be out of position against an aggressive opponent who could easily blow us off our draw on the turn. Also, if BB three-bets us solidly we're going to hate our lives.

I like a smooth-call here. The odds that we can extract some extra value if we hit are pretty solid, and the odds that we get a free river card (or even showdown) are pretty good as well. Why push out our potential extra profit margin given that we're almost surely going to have to hit to win anyways?