99 flops overpair linecheck

unzip · #1 09-20-2007, 10:25 AM

First round in the table.
Never seen aggro villain before.

Party Poker 0.25/0.50 Hold'em (9 handed) Hand History Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com (Format: 2+2 Forums)

Preflop: Hero is UTG+1 with 9[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], 9[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img].
1 fold, Hero calls, 2 folds, MP3 calls, 1 fold, Button raises, SB calls, 1 fold, Hero calls, MP3 calls.

Here I sometimes call, sometimes raise. But in the new table I tend to call w 99 EP

Flop: (9 SB) 3[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], 8[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], 5[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (4 players)
SB checks, Hero checks, MP3 checks, Button bets, SB calls, Hero raises, MP3 calls, Button 3-bets, SB calls, Hero calls, MP3 calls.

I go for a check-raise on this board. No reason not to think I have the best hand here. I'd like to see MP3 fold if its 2 cold to him. Nothing of this happens - MP3 coldcalls + Button 3-bets. I call since I see no value in capping. Button is overpair (more likely) or overcards + flush draw (less likely) or 88 (I doubt it). MP3 is flush/straight draw or 8. SB dunno and don't care much at the moment.

Turn: (10.50 BB) 2[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (4 players)
SB checks, Hero bets, MP3 calls, Button raises, SB calls, Hero folds.

Good card for me. I decide to bet so it wouldn't be checked through w draws. I get to put MP3 in bad positions between 2 aggros. Button I expect to raise with hands that beat me and go to calldown mode with hands that I beat. Once Button raises I cant think of worse hands he would do it with and fold.

Thoughts/comments/critique please.

Fantam · #2 09-20-2007, 11:09 AM

I prefer a raise to call preflop.

Flop is ok, although I think that I prefer to bet out as opposed to check/raise.

As played, I would probably check/fold the turn. I think its much more likely that button has an overpair than overcards.

GoCobbers95 · #3 09-20-2007, 11:16 AM

3 bet pf (Narrows down hands on early streets)
Flop is fine as played.
Turn check/fold (I don't mind your line here though)

voyamatarte · #4 09-20-2007, 12:11 PM

*G*

I bet out on this flop. Villians's PF raise leads me to beleive that at the most, he has an overpair, or more likely, he has overcards with maybe a flush draw or a BDFD. We dont want MP to fold at this point, because we dont know what he has, but it probably dosn't beat us. MP's money gives us better odds to stay in the pot agaisnt PF raisers aggression.

As played, I beleive that MP3 is basically turning his hand up, playing a flush draw. He is getting odds to call, so, on the turn, we could try a check/raise, but button is going to three bet us here enough where I am going to check/fold on this turn. MP3 has enough outs to beat us, and it appears that we are already behind button.

bozlax · #5 09-20-2007, 12:53 PM

Posting blind: raise preflop, bet/raise every street until you meet resistance, then call down unless an overcard falls or the board gets otherwise scary.

Having read your post: Wow. Not great. Having not raised preflop, goig for the c/r on the flop is fine, calling the 3-bet is meh. Given your flop play, donking the turn is terrible; either c/r the turn, or just call down; since you're new to the table, calling down is preferable since your FE is zero and you want to see what this guy will play hard on the flop with. fwiw, bet/folding getting 16:1 made Baby Jesus cry.

bozlax · #6 09-20-2007, 12:56 PM

The bad (very, very w/t):

[ QUOTE ]
As played, I would probably check/fold the turn. I think its much more likely that button has an overpair than overcards.

[/ QUOTE ]

The worse (donk LRR with 99?):

[ QUOTE ]
3 bet pf

[/ QUOTE ]

And, the ugly (as played, why don't you want to drive players out?):

[ QUOTE ]
I bet out on this flop.

[/ QUOTE ]

SAVE THE MICROS

Sushiglutton · #7 09-20-2007, 01:02 PM

[ QUOTE ]
Given your flop play, donking the turn is terrible; either c/r the turn, or just call down

[/ QUOTE ]

I don't get why donking is so terrible. I think it's a good play. Like OP said there are many hands BTN wcould check behind against 3 opps, like FD's OC etc. I also agree with OP that squeezing MP is good.

The thing bout CR is that AFTER BTN bets we are behind his range so CR becomes -EV. We donk because we have ok equity and are afraid of a FC.

I totally agree with u that b/f and c/f are awful lines on the turn.

Fantam · #8 09-20-2007, 01:10 PM

[ QUOTE ]
The bad (very, very w/t):

[/ QUOTE ]

Boz, Could you please explain why it is weak-tight to not call down from the turn, after the unknown button has raised pf and bet/3-bet the flop ?

I would not have thought that was standard play for an unknown villain with something like AK or AQ.

Buzz-cp · #9 09-20-2007, 01:34 PM

as all have said preflop should be a raise. I can understand not raising this hand if 2-3 people typically cold-call. I think flop is best play. Checkraising with relative position is a good strategy. We have really run into the least ideal situation, when we get cold-called and 3-bet. Now we are getting 19:1 to see a turn. The turn is where I disagree.

Since villain is unknown, I think b/f is the worst choice. If we really feel like we are ahead, we should decide to call 2 big bets and get to showdown. If we think we are behind, we should just c/f the turn. Villain has already "told" us he likes to play his hand aggressively. If he is behind, and has 6-10 outs against us, then that is unfortunate, as it's the price of being OOP with a mid-pair vs the pfr & flop 3-bettor. FWIW, I think going to SD cheaply and c/f are about even. I think we are usually behind though. Also with a known villain who plays ABC, we can b/f the turn.

Smurph64 · #10 09-20-2007, 03:16 PM

preflop 99 I raise first in at least 75% of the time. Its so much easier to play regardless of the flop if I have a lead position, I mix it up if I am up against aggro players and can get them to bet for me here but its mostly good as a raise.

As played of course the check/raise call is good on the flop.

Turn however is silly, it closes out your backdoor flush draw and button could easily have overpair.

I call down and hope only the button is the only bettor and the other guys call through.

I can't protect my hand with aggro here if he is on a flush draw.

If the flush doesn't happen on the river, I might donk there but probably c/c.