VP$IP vs. Hand Range from each Position.

[1220cardstud]

Before I even start with this question, let me make it clear that I know that every player is different. I don’t think that it is arguable that there is a direct correlation between the hands a player is willing to play and their vp$ip %. It also goes without saying (but I'm going to say it anyway) that a good players vp$ip % is dependent on what kind of a game they are playing in. With all this being said let me begin.

Is there a way to figure out (and be correct a major portion of the time) what hands a player will play, and from what position, based on their vp$ip? This would obviously not be an exact science. All this would attempt to do is give one a general idea of what hands their villain may hold.

I got this idea based on a response from KWAZ, in a post by LEADER.

[ QUOTE ]
A 17% PFR player will on average raise about 12% of hands UTG. That’s about 23 Hands.

[/ QUOTE ]

(Sorry, I don’t know how to make a link but the title of the article is Flop semi-bluff vs. LAG?)

This quote brings me to a second question. What about the percent that they PFR? Its pretty safe to assume that about ½ of the hands a good player will play are going to be raised before the flop. How does this play into what the actual hands are based on %.

This is not a problem that can be simplify solved by figuring out what % a certain group of hands are of the total.

Say a player will only play….

All Pairs = 13 (2-A) multiplied by the four different combinations = 52
And
AT+ = 16 combinations each = 4(16)= 64
Total hands = 116 hands

116/1326 x 100 = 8.74%

Then their VP$IP would translate to 8.74%, right?
WRONG!

What about the small blind? Big blind?

VP$IP includes the small blind and also calling raises from the big blind so this needs to be taken into account.

After all of these #’s have been figured out you need to then figure it out by position. Based on the hands a player plays, what portion of them will be played UTG, EP2, etc. etc. A players VP$IP can be pulled from pokertracker by position. So how does this translate.

It seems to me like this problem should not be all that hard to figure out but I'm stuck.
I do not have the background (yet) to be able to figure this out.

Thanks everyone.

P.s. Should I have posted this in the probability forum?

[FortunaMaximus]

In all probability, you could've garnered a more experienced flurry of responses from there, yeah.

You know, me either. I mean, I'm reasonably aware what x/x means in threads. 18/12 is tight, 30/23 is LAGgy, 90/80 is either retarded or the best postflop player since Northern Las Vegas opened for business.

I don't think the exact stats matter little except to mathematicians and people who multi-table and aren't paying attention to every table with their full focus.

[Victor]

or you can just look at the position page in pt.

[1220cardstud]

[ QUOTE ]
I don't think the exact stats matter except to mathematicians and people who muli-table

[/ QUOTE ]

Yup, both of these things are most definitely going to be a big part of my future. I plan on eventually getting my masters in math, possibly even in statistics.

The math part of poker is one of my major reasons I'm drawen to it.

- I'm still very much a beginner.

[1220cardstud]

[ QUOTE ]
or you can just look at the position page in pt.

[/ QUOTE ]

Yes you could but the reason that I want to figure this out is for when I'm up against a relatively newer player. I can put him on a range much easyer by looking on screen at the poker table at his vp$ip than digging into pokertacker only to find two of the hands he has played from that position.

Also when I do start to mulitable I wont have time to do that.