30-60 Bellagio situation

rsk111 · #1 08-15-2007, 04:13 PM

I've been playing for an hour and have somewhat of a LAG image. I've been pretty liberal in my range in late position and have been showing down a lot of ugly hands that end up winning the pot. A somewhat tricky TAG requests a seat change to sit to my left. In the next 10 minutes, the next two hands occur

I open from MP with AJo, TAG 3 bets, folded around, flop is 679 all clubs (I have no clubs), I check, he bets, I fold

I open from Hijack with AhQh, TAG 3 bets, everyone else folds, flop is 578 with spade draw (and no heart), I check, he bets, I call, turn 6s , I check, he bets, I fold,

1. First, please comment on how I should have handled the above two hands. The read I was getting is that he was probably 3 betting me preflop with a wide range, because he thought I was very loose. Problem was boards missed my hand so much that there was nothing I could do about it (or at least that's how I felt, correct me if I'm wrong).

2. Now I'm UTG + 3 and I'm dealt AKo, I bet and he 3 bets and it's folded around. I four bet and he calls. Flop is Q72 rainbow. What is the plan for the rest of the hand?

DeuceKicker · #2 08-15-2007, 05:31 PM

I'm not sure there's really anything you can do with the first two hands. If the OESD wasn't on the board for the second hand I'd be more willing to call down to a) see just how light he's 3-betting and b) show that I'm not going to lay down every time he isolates.

With AK I bet. You've shown a lot more strength after being pretty meek (reasonably so) twice before, so if he doesn't have a Queen or overpair he should have a tough time calling you down.

rsk111 · #3 08-15-2007, 09:46 PM

[ QUOTE ]
I'm not sure there's really anything you can do with the first two hands. If the OESD wasn't on the board for the second hand I'd be more willing to call down to a) see just how light he's 3-betting and b) show that I'm not going to lay down every time he isolates.

With AK I bet. You've shown a lot more strength after being pretty meek (reasonably so) twice before, so if he doesn't have a Queen or overpair he should have a tough time calling you down.

[/ QUOTE ]

OK you bet, and he raises, will you call or 3-bet?

pokervintage · #4 08-16-2007, 02:40 PM

Bottom line is that if you feel a player is messing around with you then you have to call him more liberally. Call him down on hand two. The flop doesn't matter.

pokervintage

pokervintage · #5 08-16-2007, 02:56 PM

Once you four bet you have almost no choice but to bet out on the flop. If he raises then you are probably beat and should call the raise and play the turn accordingly.

I don't think that I would four bet before the flop because of what has been going on with this player. I would like to get this guy off of my back so I want to show him a hand. I probably check call him (down) here if I were you since you folded hand 2.

This player has an image of you as a maniac and is now playing accordingly or as a maniac himself against you. He will continue to do so if he finds that you are a weak player and will give up easily. There is an arguement for not worrying about someone three betting your A game hands with weaker holdings but then you must call him more liberally.

Mason Malmuth has written about image. Once you create an image of playing a lot of hands good players will start to take advantage and also take shots at you. If your style of play works for you then you probably want to get out of this players game.

pokervintage

tessarji · #6 08-16-2007, 03:59 PM

I don't mind your other two folds, since the boards were so terrible for you.

Obviously in hand 3 you are going to have to get involved. Since he thinks you are a LAG and also probably that you fold easily postflop, your best line is almost certainly going to be bet/call flop, check/call turn, check/call river. If would be unwise to get more aggressive then that, because you want him to three barrel you with worse hands and you don't want to get into a raising war.

If you make a pair, check-raise the river.

tessarji · #7 08-16-2007, 04:02 PM

[ QUOTE ]
With AK I bet. You've shown a lot more strength after being pretty meek (reasonably so) twice before, so if he doesn't have a Queen or overpair he should have a tough time calling you down.

[/ QUOTE ]

I agree you should bet with AK, but not to get him to fold - you should be trying to get him to semi-bluff raise.

There is more money to be made here by inducing bluffs than by running him out of the pot.

rsk111 · #8 08-16-2007, 09:08 PM

Thanks for the input so far. Here are a couple of specific things related to this hand that I was pondering.

1. The preflop 4 bet. Factors for it are that I likely have the best hand and more importantly I am showing that I am willing to play back, which will hopefully result in fewer three bets from him. Factors against it seem to be that he may interpret my four bet as significant strength, meaning that If I do hit the flop he probably won't pay me off. In the end I'm not sure what the better approach is. Thoughts?

2. I bet the flop and he raised. I three bet for value as I really felt I had the best hand. I think this guy's range was virtually any 2 (maybe just top 80% and I was probably ahead of that range). So my question here is if you think that you are ahead here, should you three bet the flop or should you still follow the check call all the way line?

danderso8 · #9 08-16-2007, 10:27 PM

On the AhQh hand, would a 4bet preflop be spewy? It's been a while since i played this high, but in the games i play in, with the opponent described, that hand is way ahead of his range and could often get him to fold on the flop if played this way. Lead if you miss, check if you hit, and maybe his A9 or whatever pays you off.

On the AK hand, I agree that it's best to get him to bluff and bluff raise. get to showdown since you didn't on the other two.

--dan

golferbrent · #10 08-16-2007, 11:19 PM

I like how you have played the A-K hand. However, you have to be careful on the turn: What are you going to do if he raises the turn? The players in that game are capable of raising the turn with air here and making a continuation on the river. It could become very expensive hand, with you holding a marginal holding at best. Personally, I would have gone with the meek play and called him down or call the turn and lead the river, with the intention of calling a raise depending on how the board has developed.

On the A-Q hand I think you need to call him down and if the spade hits lead at the pot... call down otherwise. Clearly I think the guy is raising light here--try and find an inexpensive way to showdown with your A-high.